User talk:Toomai/Archive 12

You should say something definitive about the reporting of notable speculation issue on the talkpage, Miles is still completely reverting after not responding even when you stated you didn't disagree with it.

(And I guess you can say my revert back was also a violation, but I felt after your statement and his failure to respond back, there was no right to keep it on the reverted version.) Omega Tyrant 07:18, 1 March 2014 (EST)

While Omega and Miles are busy arguing, could you finish List of Director's Room Miiverse posts/Archive 1? Omega said he'll get to it, but it seems he's busy fighting Miles. SeanWheeler (talk) 17:02, 1 March 2014 (EST)

Stop being a lazy bastard and do it yourself if you want it up that badly right now. Omega Tyrant

17:14, 1 March 2014 (EST)

I don't have a Miiverse account. I don't have access to the director's room. If I did, the list would be complete already. I need a Miiverse account to access the Director's Room. I need a Wii U in order to sign up, since the site wouldn't let you sign up with a PC. It would take a lot of begging for my Mom to get me a Wii U. I don't know what's in my bank account, but my wallet doesn't have nearly enough cash for a Wii U console. If I do this list myself, I wouldn't be able to get all the links and the list would be based on another fansite. SeanWheeler (talk) 17:25, 1 March 2014 (EST)

[1]

There you go. They have the exact images and quotes from Sakurai. Omega Tyrant

17:29, 1 March 2014 (EST)

Phew, did what I could. Now someone will have to complete those links. You ready? SeanWheeler (talk) 20:59, 1 March 2014 (EST)

In Melee, what frame does Marth's dash become a run?

This is how you measure maximal dash dance length. I suspect it's something like frame 15.--Brian^{Don't try me!} 05:30, 2 March 2014 (EST)

It turns into run on 16, so you're in dash for 15 frames before you run, and you can tapturn any time during those 15 frames to dashdance. Toomai Glittershine

The Celeritous 19:59, 2 March 2014 (EST)

Hey there again

Could you read Talk:L-canceling and give some data on how "mashing the buttons and/or holding L and R" decreases (or fails to decrease) landing lag of an aerial move? Muchas gracias. --Timson622222 (talk) 18:06, 2 March 2014 (EST)

I think everything there has already been said. Toomai Glittershine

The Celeritous 19:59, 2 March 2014 (EST)

WHYYYYYY

Y u delete the SA Suggestions page? You said no one was voting, but someone voted a few hours before the delete! Can't you just put a message on the top of Smash Arena?75.85.64.155 23:31, 3 March 2014 (EST)

Calm down, the suggestions get purged after a while and depending on the supports, they will appear in future fight or not. ZeldaStarfoxfan2164 (talk) 00:02, 4 March 2014 (EST)

Bot request

Can I put a bot request here?

Can all pages in Category:Game Physics be moved to Category:Game physics? - Ceci n’est pas un Smiddle. 09:40, 4 March 2014 (EST)

Rightyo. X L 12:30, 4 March 2014 (EST)

Moving over redirects

For pages like ! (disambiguation) and ? (disambiguation), how am I suppose to move these over a redirect? Dots (talk) The Star Fox 15:56, 5 March 2014 (EST)

Who decided that should be done? Toomai Glittershine

The Non-Toxic 16:44, 5 March 2014 (EST)

Oh good lord, Dots. On User talk:Ryxis, we were talking about removing "(disambiguation)" from the Invisibility page, not every disambiguation page... DoctorPain99 16:57, 5 March 2014 (EST)

Oh, so I wasn't suppose to do the reverting? It seems like Category talk:Disambiguation has still favored for having that (disambiguation) redundancy? Dots (talk)

The Mushroom 18:48, 5 March 2014 (EST)

It was decided on Category talk:Disambiguation that we keep things as is, with disambiguation in some titles and not others. No one decided to get rid of disambiguation in all titles. DoctorPain99 18:53, 5 March 2014 (EST)

I didn 't mean move them back. That's what we have XL for... DoctorPain99 18:59, 5 March 2014 (EST)

So then, sorry for my misunderstanding, I guess the said XL can clean up my mess. Besides, I wasn't able to move Event 29 either. Dots (talk)

The GameCube 19:05, 5 March 2014 (EST)

New Username

I'm going to make this as quick as possible: I recently got a message that said I had to pick a new username. I've already picked one out: Mirai-chan. Lets me know ASAP if this username will work or not. Zelda smash-chi (talk) 23:12, 12 March 2014 (EDT)

Looks good to me. Toomai Glittershine

The Brass 00:19, 13 March 2014 (EDT)

We probably need to talk

But not here. Some time soon we need to IRC. Semicolon (talk) 13:58, 19 March 2014 (EDT)

A couple of questions

No matter how many times they changed my edits or how many times I have read this, I can't understand why this wiki is so persistent in calling the fourth game Super Smash Bros. 4 (a pretty unclever name), despite Sakurai confirming since the reveal date that the official name is Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS (not any better than SSB4, though), those are not tentative names and if they ever changed only Sakurai can say, looks like a weird conspiration I'm forced to participate in. Every wiki in the whole internet is calling it Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and Nintendo 3DS (or some sort like that), independent wikis like Wikipedia, Bulbapedia, Super Mario Wiki, Zeldapedia, Nookiepedia and Wikia-hosted wikis like Mega Man Knowledge Base, Kirby Wiki (split in two articles BTW) and Smashpedia (whom you are still a bureaucrat) calls it by the official name but the independent Smash Bros.-centerd wiki doesn't, why? just because the community prefers to call it like that? I think only the minimal gameplay stuff should require the opinion of the community like calling tilts the strong attacks, teching the ukemi technique or tripping the unfamous prat falling; but not the title of the game. It's like calling Super Mario 3D Land by its early name Super Mario or the name initially given by Reggie: Super Mario 3D.

For a long time I have believed some navboxes could get a better accomodation and have a more neatier design, not by color as that might require messing with the MediaWiki coding for this place (but if possible would be awesome), but by a new arrangement. I work for the McLeodGaming Wiki, you know, the unfamed Wikia-hosted wiki that mainly focuses on the highly popular Super Smash Flash series of fangames. As our focus is almost the same (the series complex history, its whole content, characters' analysis and the competitive play ambit, we even shared an admin: Pikmander2) we have used the same MediaWiki code for a long time, however, I was never keen in the way the SmashWiki arranged info within its navboxes, for example within the side characters tier of the Mario universe navbox, it gets "splitted" by bosses, Assist Trophies, enemies and special move by a simple bolded text, while this is actually good for sorting I have noticed that whenever a sub-tier is neeced in a navbox in Wikipedia, a new sub-box is required as well. Here is how I solved that issues in the MG Wiki with the same template (obviously adapted to incorporate the SSF2 criteria). I also saw more convinient sorting all the stages into Versus and 1-Player sub-tiers rather than by games as items don't get this discrmination by getting sorted by games despite some not appearing anymore in a future game. BTW have you seen the location of the series symbol inside the box? from my point of view it gets more attractive there instead of the header of the box, that and because adding those symbol in the header stretched the header. Don't you think navboxes here could have a similar treatment?

Speaking of series symbols, I got to admit you inspired me to do the same thing you did here: to trace my own symbols. In order to get a more accurate representation of the official thing, I traced over rendered screenshots from the game to get the same icon, where I discovered minimal details that are always overlooked by people. Here is the Fire Emblem symbol you traced:

[2]

And here is mine:

[3]

I was wondering if I could add those symbols into the wiki to get an even more accurate symbol. The only inconvenient is that they don't share the same file format or dimensions.

The final question is simple: as items are a very important key aspect in Super Smash Bros. history, I don't know why there is not a recompilatory list on each of the games's articles. Shouldn't we have a listing?

--Byllant (talk) 05:55, 28 March 2014 (EDT)

We call SSB4 that for a few reasons:
1. Everyone else does. Sure other wikis' page titles and game websites don't, but they tend to be where people want/have to use the official name over the common one. The vast majority of players online in other contexts call it/them SSB4 (and have been since pretty much Brawl's release, so that kind of gives us a search engine advantage I would think). So yeah it is mostly "just because the community prefers to call it like that". It's also just easier at this point to say "Super Smash Bros. 4" in articles instead of "Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS" (which is just ugly).
2. We don't know yet how different the two games will be. Currently we're assuming they'll be similar enough to share a page, which lends itself to refer to the page as a group and not a pair.
3. The "for [system]" titles are objectively stupid; pretty much no one likes them.
I would argue the navbox thing is a matter of taste, though I agree that some of them are getting a bit unwieldy and could use an experiment.
I was never that impressed with my Fire Emblem symbol to begin with, I'll give it another look. Point me to any other symbols you think could use a revisit.
For whatever reason, the community really hasn't cared for game pages to have item lists. I'm personally on the fence about adding them.

Toomai Glittershine

The Quiet 10:03, 28 March 2014 (EDT)

Melee Zelda Kick vs PM Zelda Kick

There's this long debate on facebook regarding which is stronger. Got the knockback values?--Brian^{Don't try me!} 16:59, 29 March 2014 (EDT)

I'll assume you only care about the sweetspot.

SSBM Lightning Kick (both) sweetspot: 20%, Sakurai angle, 30/96 knockback

SSBB Lightning Kick (front) sweetspot: 20%, Sakurai angle, 34/95 knockback

SSBB Lightning Kick (back) sweetspot: 20%, Sakurai angle, 40/96 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (front) initial inner sweetspot: 22% (+20 on shield), angle of 35, 30/93 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (front) initial outer sweetspot: 18%, angle of 40, 25/100 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (front) late sweetspot: 16%, angle of 40, 25/100 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (back) initial inner sweetspot: 21% (+16 on shield), Sakurai angle, 35/100 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (back) initial outer sweetspot: 17%, Sakurai angle, 30/105 knockback

PM3.02 Lightning Kick (back) late sweetspot: 15%, Sakurai angle, 30/105 knockback

Toomai Glittershine

The Superlative 18:40, 29 March 2014 (EDT)

So on average in Melee I'll hit harder, but in PM once in a blue moon I'll kill like at 60?--Brian^{Don't try me!}

13:52, 1 April 2014 (EDT)

It's actually explained on the website. "The large Melee sized sweetspots don't deal quite as much damage or knockback as they did in Melee, but are still great aerials with above average range and power. The tiny Brawl sweetspots within them are extremely powerful, but are difficult to land in the heat of battle." Toomai Glittershine

The Celeritous 13:55, 1 April 2014 (EDT)

April Fools

May I participate by adding fake news about a game release? ZeldaStarfoxfan2164 (talk) is a never lover boy 23:20, 31 March 2014 (EDT)

You should be fine as long as it doesn't need a lot of work to dispose of afterwards. Toomai Glittershine

The Different 23:22, 31 March 2014 (EDT)

Competition

Here--Brian^{Don't try me!} 20:29, 2 April 2014 (EDT)

What's this site all about? Awesome Cardinal 2000 21:44, 2 April 2014 (EDT)

Don't worry. They're coordinating with us. They will only be focusing on the pro Melee scene. Run questions/concerns by me and I'll see them addressed. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 22:22, 2 April 2014 (EDT)

Move page

Can I get my User renamed to User:Myth? --TheLegendaryKRB (talk) 17:25, 3 April 2014 (EDT)

I'll give you a few days to make sure you want a name change; remind me then. Toomai Glittershine

The Pan-Galactic 22:32, 3 April 2014 (EDT)

Im pretty committed to the name Myth now. --TheLegendaryKRB (talk) 23:35, 5 April 2014 (EDT)

Account Help

Could you please delete my old account User:Hyper Sonic Megatron 1 told me you could do it thanks -Plasma Sonic —Preceding unsigned comment added by Plasma Sonic (talk • contribs) 18:10, 5 April 2014 (EDT)

Well okay, but in future don't make another account. Toomai Glittershine

The Ghostbuster 18:55, 5 April 2014 (EDT)

Edit talk

I do think merely merging the idea of Pocket with Reflect is kind of off... true, they seem to affect the same things, and have functionally similar properties (change owner of attack, generally turning it against the user), but the way Pocket works is more like a mix of Reflect's function with Kirby's Copy ability. Just my thoughts though. And thanks for cleaning up behind me... I'm not too good at making things pretty. -_-; Jarie Suicune (talk) 12:17, 9 April 2014 (EDT)

I'm looking at it from a technical point of view - so far everything reflectable and everything pocketable are the same group of attacks, and from a game design standpoint it makes sense to have the Pocket look at an object's reflective ability instead of having its own mechanic. Toomai Glittershine

The Multifaceted 12:21, 9 April 2014 (EDT)

Origins on Pages

Is excessively adding the origins to pages not contributing, since they're not related to the Smash Bros. games? I know that most pages have an origin section, but what I mean is that all I have to offer on pages are just the origins of characters, items, etc, and not much about how they're actually involved in the Smash Bros. games. I'm also new here, so that's why I'm uncertain. (ThirdPlayer (talk) 09:34, 11 April 2014 (EDT))

We have several users whose main experience is with origin sections, and that's perfectly fine because it's still part of the wiki's mainspace. Toomai Glittershine

The Spark 09:56, 11 April 2014 (EDT)

New navboxes

So, I've seen you're new split navboxes between games, but the problem is, there is no place to put the characters main pages. In fact I liked the previous nav boxes better. The new ones are a mess (no offense), they are taller, and I don't think it was very necessary for a big change. Where can we put the main character pages? And they have duplicate links. I do not think this is one of your best ideas. Just saying. I know Zero Suit Samus, Charizard, and Sheik were recently confirmed, but just because they were split from their counterparts, doesn't mean you should revamp a bunch of templates on us. SeanWheeler (talk) 16:13, 11 April 2014 (EDT)

Yellow Devil

Sakurai said that Yellow Devil was a boss, and that the way that bosses were fought in SSB4 would be a bit different. I apologize for inconveniencing you with all of this. --EpicWendigo (talk) 13:30, 12 April 2014 (EDT)

You probably want the template's talk page, not this one. Toomai Glittershine

The Pan-Galactic 14:47, 12 April 2014 (EDT)

Items and symbols

As I would like to have the existence of items aknowleged on the games' articles, I'm thinking this would be the most appropiate way (using the first game's items for the basis):

Items

Normal
File:BeamswordSSB.jpg Beam Sword File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	File:BumperSSB.jpg Bumper File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	Fan File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	File:Home-Run Bat SSB.gif Home-Run Bat File:SmashBrosSymbol.png
File:MSbombSSB.JPG Motion-Sensor Bomb File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	File:RaygunSSB.jpg Ray Gun File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	File:Bobombssb.jpg Bob-omb File:MarioSymbol(preBrawl).png	File:Fire Flower.jpg Fire Flower File:MarioSymbol(preBrawl).png
File:Greenshell.JPG Green Shell File:MarioSymbol(preBrawl).png	File:Redshell.JPG Red Shell File:MarioSymbol(preBrawl).png	File:Starman.JPG Starman File:MarioSymbol(preBrawl).png	File:Hammerssb.jpg Hammer File:DKSymbol(preBrawl).png
File:Heart.JPG Heart Container File:ZeldaSymbol.png	File:MaximtomatoSSB.JPG Maxim Tomato File:KirbySymbol.png	File:StarrodSSB.JPG Star Rod File:KirbySymbol.png	File:Pokeball.JPG Poké Ball File:PokemonSymbol(preBrawl).png
Containers
Barrel File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	Capsule File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	Crate File:SmashBrosSymbol.png	Egg File:SmashBrosSymbol.png

This is what I would call a prototype. As you can see, we don't have artworks for the container items but they do exist, if you check page 15 of the game's manual, you'll came upon them, though they are rather small to be cropped, but seeing the lack of sources, we might need to crop those so this table could work. Check page 17 as well, note the Heart Container's and Maxim Tomato's artworks, all these years this wiki has been using squashed version of them. That's something that must be corrected. Feel free to tell me if there is something that needs to be changed on this table.

Now you told me to point out which symbols need to be revised so I would suggest the Metroid post-Brawl symbol, here, the edges in the inner line are very sharp and pointy, but the official rendition proves those edges are thin and squared, I made it like this. Kirby's symbol can also get a touch, this wiki's one is a bit round in the Warp Stars corner's as well as five the arms' tips, mine is a bit sharpy on those corners, but still, the official symbol is fattier. Game & Watch's symbol needs a touch by exagerating a bit more the curves of Mr. Game & Watch silhouette, that's a symbol I haven't tried to make.

--Byllant (talk) 00:01, 13 April 2014 (EDT)

I'll have a look at those icons. If you're going to continue with the items thing, I suggest you halve the size of the images, which should allow more columns and make the table smaller so they don't make the page much larger than it is. Toomai Glittershine

The Sharp 00:08, 13 April 2014 (EDT)

Also, I don't think it's necessary to split containers. It'll just make the table design more complicated for later games. Toomai Glittershine

The Superlative 00:27, 13 April 2014 (EDT)

OK that's fine, but what about the missing artworks? should the Maxim Tomato's and the Heart Container's artworks be stretched?

--Byllant (talk) 22:08, 13 April 2014 (EDT)

People want an article on Marth's up B.

PPU wants my help making a sequel. Any help would be appreciated!--Brian^{Don't try me!} 12:13, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

I can fill in the page with technical data if you start it, but that's about it. Toomai Glittershine

The Orchestral 12:25, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

Perfect--Brian^{Don't try me!}

13:33, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

Icons in the character pages!

"I see no reason to have some images here smaller than others, it's barely even noticable"

The reason is actually quite simple! First of all, the icons effected are specific -- namely, the Melee icons. The reason is because the format of the Brawl icons is different from that of the Melee ones. Take a notice on vs , or vs . In the case of Brawl icons, the icons themselves don't fully fit the pictures themselves; they are about three pixels smaller, and the rest is transparent. That causes a serious (as opposed to barely noticable) presentation problem, which you can see here: how it appears vs how it's supposed to appear. I'm concerned about page consistency, so, I thought changing the icon sizes a bit would be a good temporary solution (since there may be more bureaucracy in uploading new versions of the icons themselves). Just a little explanation of the issue. If you understand the problem, it would be nice if we could have the icons formatting appear consistent across pages. :) --Ash_Pokemaster (talk) 16:16, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

I have to look extremely hard to see a difference in that comparison you posted. The difference is there yes, but given that there's going to be inconsistency no matter what we do (as once SSB4 comes out we'll almost certainly be having three games' worth of icon types there), I don't think fidding with minor size changes are worth doing.

That being said, I'm beginning to wonder why that table exists at all when we have this one, and I'm thinking of merging them together in some way. Toomai Glittershine

Le Grand Fromage 16:35, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

The size difference is fairly obvious to my eyes, but I have to agree. The only thing the "Playable characters" table offers that the other table doesn't is a predesigned order to the characters and series (which is to day, the Mario series is first, or Pikachu is the first in the Pokémon series). Furthermore, the Playable characters table is very UX-inconsistent for a number of reasons: non-standard spacing between rows (notice the one-character universes), series-based ordering (highlighting the characters as Universe elements, when the table is supposed to highlight them as standalone entities), and it just looks ugly in general. With a little work, the main table can become quite good. The only thing it needs is a prefixed character ordering. My suggestion would be ordering them in order of first appearance. The old Smash Bros. site is still up and the Melee site even has the dates of each characters revelation, so, that shouldn't be hard even for older characters. --Ash_Pokemaster (talk) 17:15, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

I'm currently working on an alternative. Toomai Glittershine

The Incomprehensible 17:16, 14 April 2014 (EDT)

Theories

Where can I discuss them? --EpicWendigo (talk) 21:40, 15 April 2014 (EDT)

That depends what exactly you mean by "theories". If you have a theory of why a glitch happens, the glitch's talk page is best. For a theory on why something was designed that way or theories of in-universe things, you'd use the forums (but be mindful of SW:NOT). Toomai Glittershine

The Zesty 21:45, 15 April 2014 (EDT)