Talk:List of companies with minor representation

Hudson

Should Hudson Soft be included in the list? Sure, the company was acquired by and absorbed into Konami in 2011 and 2012, respectively, but ceased to exist after the absorption into said company. Juju1995 (talk) 01:58, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

I think can do, because the Bomberman was born before the Hudson was acquired. However, the situation is ambiguous.--Capstalker (talk) 11:30, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

I kinda thought about the same thing, too. Juju1995 (talk) 11:49, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

Given how Bomberman is currently listed on Konami's page (and is being treated as such on the wiki in general), I don't think it would be necessary to bring up Hudson. Though, Konami's page does specify that Konami only owns the Bomberman series, so... Aidan, the Rurouni 11:56, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

Hudson may be a second-party developer for Nintendo, being the original developer of the Mario Party series, and ever since the Konami acquisition, several of Hudson's Mario Party staff moved to the Nintendo-owned developer NDcube. Of course, that's just my opinion. Juju1995 (talk) 12:14, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

Almost every third-party company with their own pages has ever developed games for Nintendo. The second-party I understand is that Nintendo owns part of the ownership in the company or the game, but not all.--Capstalker (talk) 13:10, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

Separate section and maybe a page rename.

I feel like there should be a separation between companies whose properties have more major representation in the series (Assist Trophies, items, or stages) vs. companies that have very minor representation (trophies, stickers, or spirits). Also, while companies like Ubisoft and WayForward having representation in Smash is pretty special, there's still plenty of second/third-party companies that also have minor representation in the series (Some companies even have multiple IPs represented in Smash, such as indieszero, Sandlot, Skip Ltd., Cing, iNiS, Grounding inc., Red Entertainment, Mistwalker, and MuuMuu).

And if we're gonna agree with the former statement, can we also change the title, too? Brownie Brown (now 1-Up Studios) and ND Cube have IPs they created represented in Smash (Magical Starsign and Wii Party, respectively), but both are wholly owned by Nintendo, so calling them "third-party" wouldn't be technically correct. SuperSmashTurtles (talk) 19:22, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

One page is fine for it; otherwise, we should give Tekken, Nintendo Labo, and Tales of Symphonia heir own pages because they have mii costumes. Removing “third-party” from the title should be fine though. Lou Cena (talk) 19:28, May 2, 2019 (EDT)

I’m agree with Lou Cena here. But I have some questions, the developers of the spinoff-series should be included? (like AlphaDream by Mario & Luigi) If yes, the third-party universe the same? (like Inti Creates by Mega Man Zero)--Capstalker (talk) 04:06, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

We should probably include those companies too. Like I suggested, just remove “third-party” from the title, and all should go well. Lou Cena (talk) 17:28, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

We can add AlphaDream anyway since Tomato Adventure has some spirits in Ultimate. As for developers who're only represented with games they developed that are of already represented universes (Like Cap said, Inti Creates with Mega Man Zero)...I'm not really sure, honestly. SuperSmashTurtles (talk) 19:39, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

Friendly Reminder

Please refrain from uploading the logo to any company until you gain permission from them. Otherwise, that's seen as copyright infringement, and thus could get this site possibly taken down. And that's the last thing we want. Crazy456Rhino (talk) 09:35, May 9, 2019 (EDT)

Spike Chunsoft and Dragon Quest

By the same logic that puts Platinum with major companies for their involvement in the Bayonetta series, should Spike Chunsoft not also also be moved up since they developed the first five Dragon Quest games? Erdrick and the DQIV protag both hail from that era of the franchise so some of their work is represented by a fighter. NuFace (talk) 18:04, June 11, 2019 (EDT)

Considering that the first DQ was developed by it, I think we should give a page. But I heard that character design was always done by Enix, I don't know if it's important. And Level-5 developed the DQVIII, it seems that there should also be a page.--Capstalker (talk) 05:00, June 20, 2019 (EDT)

I'm unsure, because within the Dragon Quest series, Chunsoft was considered a subsidiary of Enix; it wasn't until after the 5th game that they broke off into their own company, and by then they were only involved with the Mystery Dungeon spin-offs. Similarly, if we count Level-5 here, they were really only involved with VIII and IX, so that'd only be enough for a minor entry at most, I think. (Also note that Platinum has its own page because they own the Bayonetta series, separate from their publishers.) DryKirby64 (talk) 05:37, June 20, 2019 (EDT)

Chunsoft is a subsidiary of Enix? I haven't heard that before, I only know that its founder once worked for Enix.--Capstalker (talk) 07:45, June 20, 2019 (EDT)

Platinum does not own the Bayonetta series. Every game they've ever developed and every IP they've ever created is fully owned by the original publisher. They've talked about only recently working on a yet to be unveiled game they can legally call all their own. As for Chunsoft, I'm not seeing anything about them originally or ever being a subsidiary of Enix. Koichi Nakamura, their founder, apparently worked with Enix before creating the company separately, but I don't believe Dragon Quest was thing until after he had founded Chunsoft. I see your point with DQVIII too. If the established rule is "playable character created by company=Major representation" I don't really see an argument against moving them up as well.NuFace (talk) 10:18, June 20, 2019 (EDT)

You know that thing at the end of the credits of Nintendo games where they say "Nintendo is the author of this software for the purposes of copyright"? That's what they use to define who owns the characters in Smash; for Bayo's case, the credits of Bayonetta 2 say "Nintendo, SEGA, and PlatinumGames are the authors of this software for the purposes of copyright". This means Platinum has some legal claim over Bayonetta, hence their name in the copyright for "Original Characters".

As for Dragon Quest, in this case it is Square Enix who owns the copyright. Note that none of the five Dragon Quest titles Chunsoft worked on have their name on the box; they were a similar case to Yuji Horii's Armor Project, which solely maintains the characters and setting of the Dragon Quest games. Chunsoft was originally dedicated exclusively to developing for Enix, and only later split into an independent company (starting with Otogirisō for the Super Famicom). And regardless, Spike Chunsoft in its current form isn't involved in the series at all. DryKirby64 (talk) 14:48, June 20, 2019 (EDT)

Parent 3rd party companies categories

For minor subsidiary companies on the list that are owned by a major 3rd party represented in Smash, should we include the category of their parents in their file images, like this one of Taito, a Square Enix-owned company? Juju1995 (talk) 00:01, October 2, 2019 (EDT)

Creatures, Inc.

So I've been thinking about how we should handle Creatures, Inc. on this Wiki.

They've developed the Chalien franchise, which is represented in Ultimate with a spirit of the series mascot, Li'l Blue.

However, Creatures is often credited as the current name of a company called "Ape Inc.", which was the main development team for the first two EarthBound games.

So, should we put Creatures here and give Ape Inc. a page, or should we give Creatures its own page and put in all info about Ape Inc. on there instead? SuperSmashTurtles (talk) 20:39, October 4, 2019 (EDT)

As for own page, Creatures wasn't part of creating Smash Bros., so I don't think it needs a page, unless I'm mistaken on that assumption. CookiesCreme 20:42, October 4, 2019 (EDT)

You seem to have misinterpreted what I was trying to say. What I was asking is if Creatures should have their own page since they created the EarthBound series (albeit back when they were called Ape Inc.). We gave Next Level Games and 1-Up Studios pages, and they didn't contribute to much in the Smash series AFAIK (although I am against the idea of the former having its own page). SuperSmashTurtles (talk) 20:52, October 4, 2019 (EDT)

I don't see why not. Since most of Ape's staff moved on to Creatures, Inc., if an article is created it should be called Creatures, Inc. instead. CookiesCreme 20:57, October 4, 2019 (EDT)

Koei Tecmo page

With the announcement of Byleth joining the roster, I've been thinking we should probably Koei Tecmo their own page, since they did help co-develop Fire Emblem: Three Houses. If 1-Up Studio can get their own page just for co-developing Mother 3, then I don't see why not with KT. SuperSmashTurtles (talk) 01:16, January 17, 2020 (EST)

Support. I'd say they're about the same level of importance. Crazy456Rhino (talk) 09:34, January 17, 2020 (EST)

Support. I'd agree that Koei Tecmo has enough importance to Smash to warrant a page addition.ThePieMaster51 (talk) 12:15, January 18, 2020 (EST)

Oppose. While Koei Tecmo participated in the development of Three Houses, they were involved in mostly the technical side of things. Byleth is still very much of an Intelligent Systems/Nintendo character rather than a Koei one. I actually think 1-Up Studio, Next Level Games (especially this one) and Retro Studios don't need their own page either but that's somethink I will expand on on 1-Up Studio's talk page. --Rdrfc (talk) 07:26, January 19, 2020 (EST)

Oppose. I think whether these companies should have one page depends on the characters design. If KT doesn't participate in the characters design, it doesn't need one page.--Capstalker (talk) 07:52, January 19, 2020 (EST)

Toby Fox?

So, as far as I know, we're missing two companies whose IPs are represented in Smash.

First, there's Agenda, the developers of Slide Adventure Magkid, in which the tag to remind to add it has been there for quite a long time, now.

Second, and more notably, is the developer of Undertale, Toby Fox. Unique among others, Undertale is (as far as I'm aware) the only universe in the entire Smash series to be developed by a one-man team.

Considering how the rest of the companies listed are...well, actual companies, even including the smallest studios (Yacht Club and StudioMDHR), it makes me wonder how we should handle Toby here. I don't think we should give him a page because Undertale is only represented by a Mii Costume and a music track not to mention that the sans costume is already overhyped as it is, but he still needs to be acknowledged as a developer somehow if we're gonna list all these game developers/publishers. SuperSmashTurtles of the Turtle Tribe 22:09, April 1, 2020 (EDT)

Undertale wasn't developed solely by Toby Fox. The most notable example outside of Toby would be Temmie Chang, who has been the main artist for both Undertale and Deltarune.

As for the other point, all of the Undertale games were self-published and Toby doesn't have a company for himself, so he doesn't fit in this page. The only page that highlights individual developers is the list of developers significant to Super Smash Bros. page, where he obviously isn't notable enough for inclusion. Nokii — 23:10, April 1, 2020 (EDT)

We are missing double elevin

Someone forgot to put in double eleven, if you forgot they developed minecraft Dungeons which is represented by 2 songs in smash —Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.15.147.53 (talk • contribs) 12:32, January 29, 2021 (EST)

Double Elevin

We should add that company since the Co-developed by that game + Mojang, and that is represented with two songs 73.15.147.53 23:53, February 13, 2021 (EST)

Midway

Should Midway be here? They Did create Mrs. Pac-man, who appears in the Pac Land stage AgedofallStrings (talk) 12:59, March 19, 2021 (EDT)

Drop the game-by-game subheaders?

In the interest of making this page more readable and easier to navigate, would it be a good idea to drop the "In Super Smash Bros. _____" subheaders per company and simply explain in the prose which representation is in which game? This would also be a good opportunity to drop repetitive mentions of the same content in multiple games. Miles (talk) 17:10, May 27, 2021 (EDT)

Bumping; this page is a mess to read and I think this would help greatly. Miles (talk) 02:38, May 30, 2021 (EDT)

I think this would benefit the pages, to keep things more consolidated. It's not meant to be a full-on universe page in each section. Aidan, the Rurouni 15:15, May 30, 2021 (EDT)

Good idea. --Meester Tweester (talk) 15:45, May 30, 2021 (EDT)

Support: Would definitely help with the readablity of the article. Señor Mexicano (talk) 16:32, May 30, 2021 (EDT)

Yes: So many sections are just a single sentence, removing them would make the page less messy. Omegα Toαd, the Toαd Wαrrior. (I'm the best!) 21:36, May 30, 2021 (EDT)

Disney

It's been agreed on that some elements in Smash are inspired by Kingdom Hearts, which is owned by The Walt Disney Company. However, those elements are so minor that I don't know if a mention on this page is warranted. What do you all think?The Other Jared (talk) 17:04, June 3, 2021 (EDT)

Yeah, those elements are way too minor to give Disney its own section here. Not to mention that said elements within the Kingdom Hearts series only applied to the Final Fantasy characters, which are owned by Square Enix. SuperSmashTurtles of the Turtle Tribe 17:58, June 3, 2021 (EDT)

If we added Disney, they we would've also had to add Bitstep, Broderbund and Ω Force for Dreamix, Lode Runner, and Warriors Respectively. AgedofallStrings (talk) 00:40, June 19, 2021 (EDT)

Late reply, but Omega Force is at least fair game since Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity does have spirits in Ultimate. I completely agree with the other two, though. The Jacketed Terrapin 18:40, August 6, 2021 (EDT)

TPCI

Should The Pokémon Company International be here? Most of the Pokémon Post-Brawl are voiced by people from the TPCI Dub. AgedofallStrings (talk) 00:30, June 19, 2021 (EDT)

I'll admit, this one is a bit complicated. TPCI is a joint venture between nintendo, game freak and creatures. Also, everything they have made is technically already in the Pokemon universe page, which mentions the company. I would say to not add it here. Either make a dedicated article or leave everything as is.The Other Jared (talk) 13:50, June 26, 2021 (EDT)

Magnavox

Nintendo acquired the rights from Magnavox to develop their own hardware based on the Magnavox Odyssey in 1977. This resulted in the Color TV-Game series, which is represented in Smash. Is this enough to warrant a mention of Magnavox on this list?The Other Jared (talk) 13:21, August 6, 2021 (EDT)

Like What Terrapin stated, Their representation is way too minor to have a section on this page. AgedofallStrings (talk) 18:18, August 6, 2021 (EDT)

Armor Project, Bird Studio, Sugiyama Kobo, and ILCA

I've been thinking about adding them in this list for a while now, however I am unsure if it's necessary to do so, since all four of them have contributed in the Dragon Quest series. The first three are held by Horii, Toriyama and Sugiyama respectively. The lattermost, ILCA, has contributed on other games from Square Enix (Nier Automata, Dragon Quest XI), The Pokémon Company (the remake of Diamond and Pearl), and recently Bandai Namco (Ace Combat). Prolyfic8 (talk) 16:34, August 23, 2021 (EDT)

Team Ninja

Since Metroid Other M is developed by Team Ninja, a Koei Tecmo Subsidiary, Should the Other M stuff be mentioned on the Koei Section or should they have their own dedicated section? AgedofallStrings (talk) 19:29, September 1, 2021 (EDT)

Should Next Level Games be moved to its own page?

I think it's somewhat odd that Next Level Games is still listed under this page, considering how they have a fair amount of content in Ultimate. Super Mario Strikers is represented with 2 spirits and the Soccer Ball item, Punch-Out's representation is largely based on their contributions to the series, there's a fair amount from their Luigi's Mansion games (including Luigi's Mansion 3), and there's even a bit of content from Federation Force. I'd argue that they deserve to be upgraded to having their own page, considering how Retro Studios and PlatinumGames have their own pages despite not being listed in Ultimate's copyright. Plus, Next Level is now a first-party Nintendo studio, and, like Retro, their representation in the game is tied directly into character appearances and movesets (namely Little Mac and Luigi). I get that Retro Studios actually created Dark Samus while Next Level only redesigned Little Mac, but I still think it would make sense for them to have their own page, whereas other Nintendo-owned/Nintendo partner studios like NDCube, Camelot, Good-Feel, Grezzo, and MercurySteam don't have as much going for them. Heck, Retro Studios didn't even have a page until Dark Samus was announced for Ultimate - so why not have Next Level? Would love to hear what thoughts people have on the matter! PikaPhantom (talk) 20:37, November 21, 2021 (EST)PikaPhantom

Sikorsky Aircraft

Sikorsky Aircraft helped develop the Cypher, which is used for Snake's up special. So, should they be added here? AgedofallStrings (talk) 22:29, December 6, 2021 (EST)

Considering Sikorsky Aircraft has only created the real-life inspiration of the Cypher and has no involvement with the Metal Gear series itself (AFAIA, anyway), it would definitely belong more on this page, but even then, I'm not sure if it should really qualify there, either. The Jacketed Terrapin 00:15, December 7, 2021 (EST)

It is used in the Metal Gear series. A Cypher is used by The Patriots during the Tanker chapter, taking a picture of Snake standing over a defeated Olga Gurlukovich in order to frame him for a terrorist attack on the marine tanker Discovery. There are also the Gun Cypher Enemies. They were also the automated flying security cameras that patrolled the bridges between the struts of the Big Shell in Metal Gear Solid 2. So, maybe? AgedofallStrings (talk) 21:20, December 10, 2021 (EST)

Phoenix Planning

Does anybody know what Phoenix Planning is? It’s listed in Ultimate's credits but I couldn’t find anything on it. Ss4 (talk) 13:52, January 25, 2022 (EST)

I couldn't find anything either. Found companies in the UK and Japan, but they were both about planning/logistics/etc. and nothing to do with video games, which is what Phoenix Planning is listed under in the credits. Lot's of stuff about Phoenix, Arizona's Planning and Development division, but still not useful. Perhaps one of the "other" spirits' games had PP has part of the dev team but was uncredited for some reason or for a very specific localization. --CanvasK (talk) 18:16, January 25, 2022 (EST)

Credited Companies

I like the idea of the Credited companies section, though some guidelines should be put in place to make sure a war over what goes where doesn't happen. My initial idea is that companies that are credited, but did not directly make something that appears in the Smash series should not have a dedicated section. For example, companies that created an asset sourced from elsewere like avex and Edelweiss should receive their own section, but companies that are credited exclusively for legal reasons like NexTone and Sikorsky should be put in the credited company section. I am also debating over whether trailer animation houses should have a dedicated section or not.The Other Jared (talk) 01:50, October 16, 2022 (EDT)

On the sound scale of things..

...do companies from which sound effects, samples and instruments were used like Sound Ideas, Apple, Toho and Roland warrant a mention or a they far too minute?