Editing Talk:K.K. Slider

==Delete==
Does this really deserve a page? Sure, when he's there you get unique music, but that doesn't affect the game in any way. We might as well have a page for Harriett and the Able Sisters. They have about the same role. <small>---Preceding unsigned comment added by [[Special:MyPage|you]]. Or maybe [[User:Nutta Butta|Nutta.]] </small> 19:36, 5 December 2014 (EST)
:I agree with deleting. Background characters don't deserve pages. [[File:TepigSprite.png]][[User:Tepig|Tepig]] ([[User talk:Tepig|talk]]) 17:58, 11 December 2014 (EST)
:'''Oppose''', K.K.'s presence is responsible for a unique mechanic (using different music based on time/date) and the additional relevance of his trophy in Melee seals the deal. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 12:13, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::'''Oppose'''. I agree with Miles on this. {{s|user|PikaSamus}} ([[User talk:PikaSamus|talk]]) [[File:PikaSamusSig.png|12px|link=Special:Contributions/PikaSamus|PikaSamus]] 12:15, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::'''Oppose''' If K.K. was simply watching the match, I could have supported. However, as Miles said, he plays a unique role, and that is good enough to keep this article. [[User:Berrenta|Berrenta]] ([[User talk:Berrenta|talk]]) 13:16, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:Actually, Miles made a good point. I '''oppose''' it now. [[File:TepigSprite.png]][[User:Tepig|Tepig]] ([[User talk:Tepig|talk]]) 13:26, 17 December 2014 (EST)

'''Delete''' K.K. Slider's role is no more than any other background character, he just happens to take the spotlight (in the background) under certain stage-specific conditions. It's not like how Kraid drives the rotation of Brinstar Depths - K.K. is subservient to the stage. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Awesome 13:37, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:Kraid drives a major component of Brinstar Depths (spinning the platforms). K.K. drives a major component of Smashville (the music). They both warrant pages. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 13:43, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::The stage picks the music (which is completely irrelevant to gameplay, unfortunately) and brings in the correct background characters to suit. K.K. is a participant, not a driver. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Different 13:48, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::The music in a Smash match is a central element; I'd hardly call it irrelevant. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 13:49, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::::I'd love to agree that music is an integral part of the game, but the unfortunate reality is that it isn't relevant to gameplay in the slightest degree. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Yoshi 13:53, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::::How is it not? It's the game actually overriding a player controlled interface (My Music), so you can't argue that it's non-interactive if that's what you're getting at. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 14:00, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::::::No matter what you do with the music (distort, change, repalce, remove, mute, etc), the actual gameplay (fighting your opponent) does not change in any way. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Victorious 14:53, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::::::That's an extremely narrow definition of gameplay, though. And we maintain a great number of pages on elements of the games beyond those which affect the direct combat between characters. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 14:58, 17 December 2014 (EST)
'''Support deletion.''' He's only a background character, and as such, shouldn't get a page. He doesn't affect gameplay at all, with the exception of the music in [[Smashville]], but that's not really notable enough for its own page, and can just be easily be put on the [[Smashville]] page. <font face="Marker Felt">[[User:Rtzxy|<span style="color:red;">Rtzxy</span>]] [[File:Reflect.jpg|20x20px]] [[User talk:Rtzxy|<span style="color:green;">''Reflect!''</span>]]</font> 15:04, 17 December 2014 (EST)
<br>'''Strong Oppose''' I concur with Miles. Music is a very important part in Smash. <span style="font-family:AR JULIAN; font-size:12pt">[[User:ChuckNorris24|<span style="color:red">Chuck</span>]][[User talk:ChuckNorris24|<span style="color:green">Norris</span>]]</span>[[File:24.png|23px]]  16:09, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:I fail to see how music effects the game in the same way that the platform rotating does. All other stage elements with pages ([[Fish]] and [[Kraid]], for example) directly change the battle. Music is just background noise to make the battle more interesting. It doesn't matter if it's interactive, or if this is a special occasion on music. All K.K. Slider needs is a mention of Smashville to the effect of "On Saturday nights, K.K. Slider may appear and play one of his songs." There isn't enough information on this page relevant to Smash. <small>---Preceding unsigned comment added by [[Special:MyPage|you]]. Or maybe [[User:Nutta Butta|Nutta.]] </small> 16:14, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::That's as fallacious as trying to reduce Kraid's presence "Kraid may appear and spin the stage." Also, K.K.'s on two stages, and has been a trophy in three games, both of which are more than can be said for Kraid. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 16:57, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::Honestly Kraid isn't overly deserving of a page, but he has a bigger role than K.K. Slider's. Both of their pages are made up of non-Smash based information. I'm tempted to clean up the overly irrelevant information (keeping the information that's important to the character) just to see if they really deserve pages. <small>---Preceding unsigned comment added by [[Special:MyPage|you]]. Or maybe [[User:Nutta Butta|Nutta.]] </small> 18:03, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::::Both deserve a page. As you may have seen [[User:Miles of SmashWiki/To-do list|here]], I'm aiming for a slightly broader range of characters that warrant articles, not fewer. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 19:28, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:::::I proposed [[SmashWiki:Creating new articles|this]] for a reason, as a guideline as to what can and cannot become an article. I really don't want a wider range of article choices, mainly because I don't want this wiki to be MarioWiki-like with articles. <font face="Marker Felt">[[User:Rtzxy|<span style="color:red;">Rtzxy</span>]] [[File:Reflect.jpg|20x20px]] [[User talk:Rtzxy|<span style="color:green;">''Reflect!''</span>]]</font> 19:53, 17 December 2014 (EST)
::::::As I clarify in more detail on the talk page of my userpage listed above, I'm using very specifically delineated rules for what does and doesn't get an article. K.K. would under my system as a background element that does more than simply appear visually, making him more significant than most other background elements (Four Giants on Great Bay, Skarmory on PS2, and so on). [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 20:22, 17 December 2014 (EST)

If the only reason he has a page is because of your personal rules, we probably need a policy. <small>---Preceding unsigned comment added by [[Special:MyPage|you]]. Or maybe [[User:Nutta Butta|Nutta.]] </small> 20:58, 17 December 2014 (EST)
:Okay, for starters, this page has existed since before I joined the site. That aside, I would not be opposed to trying to codify this kind of thing more consistently. As it stands, I'm mostly extrapolating from the kinds of pages we already have and trying to be more consistent (again, see [[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki/To-do list|here]]). [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 21:15, 17 December 2014 (EST)
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