SmashWiki talk:Autoconfirmed users

A note

Since autoconfirmation is removed if you have to make a new account for whatever reason (such as losing your password; it's happened on several occasions before), you may already have the experience without being autoconfirmed. Should this be mentioned in the admin section? ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 16:15, 16 January 2016 (EST)

Someone who just had to make a new account because they forgot their password probably does not use the site enough to have a shot at adminship. Toomai Glittershine The Bold 18:22, 16 January 2016 (EST)

It's happened before. ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 18:26, 16 January 2016 (EST)

Change autoconfirm timer start?

This idea was brought up on the Discord server: we could change the timer on autoconfirm from "begins when account is created" from "begins when first edit is made". I think it's kind of a pointless difference, but some people believe this would help the recent spate of users who wait out the timer, spam some trash edits, and thus get autoconfirm "by surprise". Toomai Glittershine The Steppin' 16:54, February 9, 2022 (EST)

Support: As I stated in discord, it's not a big difference, but it'll only serve to inconvenience bad faith users, while good faith users will be virtually unaffected, making a boon overall, even if slightly so. Omega Tyrant 16:58, February 9, 2022 (EST)

Support. Rather be safer than sorry in my opinion. Plus, no matter how many days have passed, it shouldn't make sense for people to have autoconfirmed tools if they have only made 10 edits. CookiesCreme 16:59, February 9, 2022 (EST)

Support. Thegameandwatch The Nerd 17:18, February 9, 2022 (EST)

Support. I've encountered this too many times, even ignoring the recent ones. At worst we'll get people making nonsense edits in the Sandbox or doing seemingly nothing-edits to start the timer, but we get that already without that kind of incentive. --CanvasK (talk) 17:44, February 9, 2022 (EST)

Oppose. I honestly can't imagine this would be all that helpful. They could just make their edits as soon as they join and then wait out the timer, or make a single edit and then wait before making the rest. This seems like at best a band-aid solution, and at worst, a move that simply makes the Wiki more restrictive for good faith users who are struggling to find things to edit and don't want to make worthless edits. Alex the Weeb 17:57, February 9, 2022 (EST)

"They could just make their edits as soon as they join and then wait out the timer, or make a single edit and then wait before making the rest."

That is still an extra step required for them, and that assumes every bad faith user will be aware of this detail to begin with.

"a move that simply makes the Wiki more restrictive for good faith users who are struggling to find things to edit and don't want to make worthless edits."

If a user isn't even editing, whether their account has autoconfirmed status or not is irrelevant to them, and they wouldn't be able to get autoconfirmed anyway if they can't make ten edits, so I don't see how this is an argument against making the timer start from the first edit. Omega Tyrant 18:37, February 9, 2022 (EST)

I mean, it's the same amount of effort on their part, regardless of when they make the edits. If someone intends to vandalize the Wiki, small gestures like this won't make a difference. The only people I can imagine being significantly affected by this are people who can't figure out where to start. The first edit is always the hardest. Alex the Weeb 20:26, February 9, 2022 (EST)

If someone wants to legitimately contribute to the wiki, then they'll legitimately contribute to it. If they want to vandalize the wiki, then having an extra, required step makes it harder for them, regardless of whether or not they know the step to begin with. (Support, by the way.) Aidan, the Lovely Rurouni 23:20, February 9, 2022 (EST)

I agree that having no contribution shouldn't make you autoconfirmed. I even thought of not having 10 edits even after 7 days shouldn't make you autoconfirmed, same for the other way around. NPM Morr!? 23:27, February 9, 2022 (EST)

"I mean, it's the same amount of effort on their part, regardless of when they make the edits. If someone intends to vandalize the Wiki, small gestures like this won't make a difference."

Except as we've seen, there are accounts that just sit around making no edits for a week or so, only to then pump out ten trash edits to get by autoconfirmed restrictions. Having to make some edit first and then wait a week is more effort, and it also increases the likelihood that they get caught before they're able to get autoconfirmed; e.g. if there's a pattern of accounts popping up that only make a single minor edit and then do nothing, it's easier to notice than random unassuming non-editing account #9347 being created.

"The only people I can imagine being significantly affected by this are people who can't figure out where to start. The first edit is always the hardest."

Again I'm not seeing the problem here. If you don't edit, then autoconfirm status doesn't matter to you. If you create an account wanting to contribute and have such difficulty making a single edit that you go a long time without making your first edit, then the ten edit requirement is probably going to be delaying you more from reaching autoconfirmed status than having to wait a week after your first edit. Plus in this scenario where someone just goes so long without making their first edit and then pumps out nine more in under a week, maybe they shouldn't be given autoconfirmed status immediately upon their tenth edit? The community still needs to see if the user is trustworthy enough and give them guidance if necessary before they start potentially messing up things behind the autoconfirm wall, which we can't do during the time the account is a non-entity. Omega Tyrant 01:40, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Support 100%, After hearing about a sockpuppet blatantly waiting 7 days to get around the autoconfirmed timer in order to edit the wiki to edit protected pages and upload images, when i was brought attention to this thing on discord, i felt like it could be a necessary change for some of the more inexperienced sockpuppets. S3AHAWK (talk) 02:21, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Support OMG yes. Wikipedia has a policy called NOTHERE, which covers people who are 'not here to build an encyclopedia'. One of the things covered therein is people who deliberately game the system. Such people usually get banned permanently. What's being proposed here won't prevent such occurrences (which I believe should result in automatic permabans, but that's another story), but it will certainly go a long way towards mitigating them, and at little to no cost. While I'm not saying we should always follow Wikipedia's example, there are some basic principles they follow that we probably should be as well. Black Vulpine the 🦊Furry🐺. Furries make the internets go! :3 04:01, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Support I would prefer to look at it from the perspective of "helps, even in a minor way," as opposed to the perspective of "does so little it's basically worthless." It won't help a huge deal, but it'll help. Sincerely, Samuel the Banjo-Kazooie Boss. 18:59, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Hey everyone, based on the response I went ahead and implemented this change. --Porplemontage (talk) 21:40, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Support. Zora Sorata⚡ I support one million percent this idea. I'm from Tijuana. Mexico, the region from where Sparg0 is. A lot of people don't know that my region is one of the best worldwide (literally, TKD, Eddy Mexico, Bimbo, WaKa and AlanDiss are from here as well), and as such, a lot of good players from here don't get the recognition they deserve. I came here to create a Wiki on myself as a player and caster; to create a page for Soid and a lot of other great players, TOs and casters, all for the soul purpose of documenting everything and giving everyone the recognition they need and deserve. However, when I created my account, turns out I have to edit some other document, which made me kind of confused as it doesn't make any sense to me. Like, why would I edit some random article I don't have any knowledge at all just to be able to create a new page of info that I actually have some knowledge from? It doesn't make any sense to me. I believe the change should be just 7 days after creating an account instead of 7 days after editing some article (which is what I'm doing right now). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zora Sorata (talk • contribs) 22:16, September 10, 2023 (EDT)

This topic has already been decided on over a year-and-a-half ago. I also think you misunderstood it. The vote was to go from "7 days since account creation" to "7 days after first edit" (there seems to be a typo in the initial proposal). If you plan on making so many articles, then the 7 days should give you time to learn the ropes. I recommend reading SmashWiki:Smasher article guidelines and some of the other policies/guidelines to avoid some common pitfalls. --CanvasK (talk) 22:56, September 10, 2023 (EDT)