Forum:Obsoletion policy

Forums: Index → Proposals → Obsoletion policy

This is a closed discussion about a failed proposed change on SmashWiki. It remains for archival purposes. The closing administrator adds: "Only met with significant opposition and no support after a week, while no valid use case for this new template was provided. Omega Tyrant 21:54, June 13, 2023 (EDT)"

Hi, I’m proposing a new policy regarding use of the {{t|Obsolete} template. What makes me propose this policy is that the conditions change depending on the namespace. Good obsoletion candidates include:

• Pages or sections that include obsolete information (e.g. outdated information that could not be possibly updated).
• Unused categories or templates that have been decided against deleting. These types of candidates must have explicit proof that they will never be used on the wiki.
• Project pages (e.g. policies) that are no longer effective.
• Outdated help pages that could not be possibly updated or useful.
• Beta images. This will help clean up the “High quality unavailable” category.

I don’t want to clutter up meta categories that contain obsolete pages. This is the biggest reason why I’m proposing this policy and why I created the template in the first place. Jordan2009, the Sora Main Talk here 16:00, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

Oppose

1. Oppose. I appreciate the proposal you made, but I do not see any use for it. Derekblue1 (talk) 22:14, June 6, 2023 (EDT)
2. Oppose. Pretty confusing proposal. Articles that become obsolete and that are wasting space for this website would be tagged with a "Candidate for deletion". This feels like an unnecessary extra step. --Tacho99 (talk) 22:27, June 6th, 2023 (EDT)
3. Yeah, I don't see what the purpose of this template/category is, basically echoing OT's comment: almost all of it's intended usage are just for stuff that we'd delete, or is already covered by an existing template that does the job better. Ultimate Toad, the Ness main. (Fuzzy pickles!) 00:08, June 7, 2023 (EDT)
4. I don't see the use for this. --Meester Tweester (talk) 01:18, June 7, 2023 (EDT)
5. No. I know I'll be repeating some stuff, but point-by-point:
   • "outdated information that could not be possibly updated" is not inherently a bad thing. If a page does need to mention that something is old, it can just say so in the text.
   • If a wiki element is unused but not deleted, there is probably a reason that isn't "obsolete"-related.
   • We have {{repealed policy}} for dead policies, which is more descriptive.
   • If a help page is no longer any good, it should be changed so it is, or deleted. There is no middle ground here.
   • Using {{HighQualityUnavailable}} for beta images is the reason the template/category was created in the first place (and is still its primary purpose).

   This idea says it aims to reduce clutter, but it would actually create an entirely new layer of clutter, with new discussions over whether something is "obsolete" or should instead be treated normally. No good. Toomai Glittershine The Spark 07:53, June 7, 2023 (EDT)

6. Oppose., Thegameandwatch The Nerd 08:57, June 7, 2023 (EDT)

Comments

Some things right off the bat:

• Using this on mainspace pages is a complete no go; pages about subjects that are no longer relevant are already explicitly written on a historical basis, this template does nothing but permanently marks them with an ugly unnecessary template box and bloats their categories with a pointless meta category.

• Slapping this on beta images is a complete no go as well. They are not "obsoleted" when the pages they're on is typically about explicitly showing off unused/beta content in the Smash games, and {{HighQualityUnavailable}} is far more appropriate when said images are of poor quality, when the purpose of that template is exactly what it says, letting people know we most likely can't get a better quality image of the thing being shown and so don't put {{Lowquality}} on them.

• Unused categories and templates that no longer serve a purpose should just be deleted, we don't keep unused categories and templates around that have no possible valid purpose to be used.

• As for the pages of policies we no longer enforce and other SmashWiki/Help space pages that no longer apply, we already have {{Repealed policy}} for that.

I'm not seeing much of a valid use case for this template, I suppose it works on the IRC page, but if that's the only page it's going to be used on, then there's not much purpose to creating a template for one page when the custom message box on it already does the job. Omega Tyrant 19:53, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

What about the fourth point I listed about help pages? Is that valid? Jordan2009, the Sora Main Talk here 20:29, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

"As for the pages of policies we no longer enforce and other SmashWiki/Help space pages that no longer apply, we already have {{Repealed policy}} for that." Omega Tyrant 20:33, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

Should we just cancel this and delete the template and category? Jordan2009, the Sora Main Talk here 20:39, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

I already alerted the Discord server about this, if you or anyone else can come up with a valid use case that isn't better done by already existing templates and that won't only apply to one or two pages, then maybe there will be something. Omega Tyrant 20:43, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

I see no other uses. Jordan2009, the Sora Main Talk here 20:45, June 6, 2023 (EDT)

Honestly, the logic I read from this template is "It’s unused, but don’t delete it, let’s archive it." and it makes me go "??????". If something goes unused, it has to be deleted as it was not used, it just makes the page messy. Derekblue1 (talk) 21:42, June 6, 2023 (EDT)