User talk:IceHoneyTea

Talk page comments

Please don't remove talk page comments, even if they are your own. As per SW:TALK, they are meant to be permanent record of every users' actions. Superbound (talk) 05:31, January 4, 2021 (EST)

I'm going to interject and bring up your reposting said message on MemeDedede's page, which now comes off as passive-aggressive at best, and at worst, a direct personal attack. Have a read of that and this policy as well. Black Vulpine of the 🦊Furry Nation🐺. Furries make the internets go! :3 06:42, January 4, 2021 (EST)

Page edits

OK, let me clarify a few things in the Zelda metagame. Although Rienne is likely the top Zelda in the current metagame, beating Kage on stream does not mean Zelda beats Ganon (at all). Why? This is because streams are simply not tournament-level play. Streams are casual, meaning that players will focus more on fun rather than serious play. Your example also brings the example of Zain who has taken sets off numerous MPGR ranked players online. Is this notable? No, because online is not a serious competitive setting and lag is a heavy factor for influencing matches there. Ganon has much more consistent hitboxes, power, and combo setups to offset his low mobility. Zelda actually has lower mobility than Ganon, thanks to her lower initial dash, run speed, and Wavedash. Take a look at the dash and wavedash page to see why it contrasts your example. Although Zelda has a decent air speed, that doesn’t translate to a good air game. Her fair/bairs are inconsistent, since if you miss or land the sourspot, opponents won’t take knockback, and the hitbox is small. Dair is pretty much useless. Her side special and neutral special are pretty much liabilities, since their long casting time discourages their use in a fast-paced settings. Also, Zelda doesn’t beat Icies. Icies have faster movement (Zelda has the slowest), a better punish game since Icies can chain grab at any percent and delete stocks, faster frame data in most aspects, more rounded and greater power, and have better combo capabilities. Although the Lake indeed 4-stocked Nintendude, the latter adapted back once he learned the MU throughout the set. Drephen primarily uses Zelda for finishing off the opponent. If Zelda tries to rack up damage throughout the game, she needs to play much more carefully to avoid getting comboed/killed, (thanks to her large hurtbox despite her light weight) but this is negatively impacted by her aforementioned low mobility.

Zelda sadly isn’t underrated. Most smashers put her alongside Kirby and Bowser in the current metagame, and that indicates she is one of the worst characters in the game. A guide and a Twitch win doesn’t translate to a better metagame. MemeDedede (talk) 15:42, January 7, 2021 (EST)

-My point is not to over value Zelda, nor to say she is better. We can document the different VALUABLE options she has against the high tier matchups, instead of downgrading her whole existence. Such as her niche advantages against low weight characters. For the icies, historically talking, Zelda has been in a favorable position, due to the nature of her kit to separate the pair. Now, hear me out. Im pretty sure Zelda will never change tier... Like ever. Although, alot has been going on very recently about this character. I might be sugar coating the whole thing, I never clap back to a reality check. Where i do have a problem, is to discredit any kind of updated content. The win against Kage might have been just for fun, we are talking about the best at one character in the world. Dont forget he has some win against Mango under his belt. For a mere Zelda to win against this is quite a big deal, streaming or not. This just goes on to show that Rienne might of done it just for fun too, this concept has to be viewed from both sides of the medal. And even if Zelda has a poor matchup against Icies, for some time she was considered notoriously good against them. Theres a lot of information out there that would blow your mind. Her lightning kicks have a huge disjointed hitbox, its not for nothing she can kill confirm out of a up throw. Rienne is currently working on a break down of these hitbox btw. Her down air is currently bad since its hard to pull off. It has alot of proprieties that you probably dont even know about when used around platforms. Thats where the move itself becomes interesting. Thought i do agree that side special is actually bad, neutral special also has a lot of strenght in the right hands. It can legdetrap, edgegard, invicible frame 4, has a very good shield poke power when you jump cancel it, and is overall a good oos option. Im also going to stop you right there with mentioning her mobility. Shes so far the only one (with samus) to share an aerial interupt mechanic. Mixed with her wacky airdodge settings, an optimized Zelda is actually on par, if not quicker than other characters (with platforms, of course). Keep in mind that Zelda is very technical (Id say right under the spacies if I didnt know any better). Just take the time to look around! Itl be worth it. IceHoneyTea (talk) 00:54, January 8, 2021 (EST)

SW:1RV

Quick thing, if your edits have been reverted previously, don't add them back as it's edit warring. Instead, bring it to the talk page. CookiesCreme 23:18, January 11, 2021 (EST)