Forum:Infobox amendment for multi-characaters players
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This is a closed discussion about a failed proposed change on SmashWiki. It remains for archival purposes. The closing administrator adds: "No compelling reasoning provided to go through with this proposal and no support gained in over a month. Omega Tyrant  15:43, May 10, 2023 (EDT)"
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Since there are actually several players (Rokki, Nurse, Greil, etc.) who don't actually have a defined main. It is actually better to have a way not listing mains. Thes players likely play whoever they want based on feelings or whatever. So there's hardly any accurate representation of mains for them. Here, I suggest making a new parameter for Infobox Smasher and call it "charssbu" or whatever games. That way there's a way to list characters without indicating if they really are mains or not. Sure it will be still hard to figure out the characters, ordering and what not. But at least it is more accurate and clear confusion for players that don't have dedicated mains. 
NPM Morr!? 
03:01, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
Add a new parameter to Infobox SmasherEdit
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Remove chars parameter for those players and state the characters they use in main paragraphsEdit
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Infobox remains the same but use "other characters" to demonstrate these charactersEdit
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Current infobox is fine as it isEdit
- Any adjustment to the current parameters is completely unnecessary, "charssbu" would do absolutely nothing but add confusion to the current infobox setup, and with the current setup, there is no limit to the amount of mains one can list in the infobox if the player truly mains that many characters. Not to mention that this "issue" applies to such an infinitesimally small amount of players, how much would any "fix" to this be actually helpful? I'll also note of the three players cited here, you can still see characters that they clearly use more than others when looking at Smashdata and their recent results on the wiki; Rokki clearly has a preference for Isabelle and Sheik, Nurse has a clear preference for Greninja (and Wario pre-covid), and Greil has a clear preference for Wolf, Kazuya, and Pythra, so I don't see how the current setup doesn't work for them. Omega Tyrant
08:20, April 8, 2023 (EDT) - While I do agree it can be difficult, or at least annoying, to deal with players who seem to play any character they want, I don't think this is really the best way to go with it. To me, a parameter like "charssbu" would not only cause more infobox bloat, but it would also be pointless: if a player uses multiple characters throughout their tournament career, it's more accurate to just add all of them into the "main" parameter, or at least include the ones they use the most. If a player truly does play whatever character they want in tournament, I personally feel like it's better to just put "random" in the parameter instead, which gets the point across better than listing all the characters they've used. Cookies
Creme 16:54, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
CommentsEdit
@OT I can agree with you this only affects a few players. That said the info box isn't particularly informative in those player instances. For example, I think it's a pretty big stretch to say rokki clearly has a preference for Isabelle and sheik. Maybe a very recent and minor one but nothing particularly significant. Some players like Nurse, Rokki over Rizeasu definitely maintain a larger roster and play off vibes more than anything else. Wiifitkid (talk) 16:17, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
- The character consistency is established enough looking at their results that putting those particular characters as their mains isn't wrong, and if you want to insist that there are other characters they use in near equal measure against meaningful opponents, then add those characters to the mains too. Also for any more details needed about their character usage, it should be explained in the article, rather than trying to make the infobox more complex for such a nonissue by adding a completely unnecessary parameter that doesn't do any better at explaining their character usage. Omega Tyrant 16:40, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
- Im undecided on whether or not theres enough warrant to change the info box, because of the same reasons you cite. This only affects a small number of player. The only reason I would consider a change is I do think it's misleading to a reader Some players just don't exhibit consistency and are prone to going an entirely another character at another tournament. Take rokki. Isabelle often appears as a top 2 used character and then there will be several events where it's the 5th or 7th most used character at that regional (or not even used). Smash data probably isn't even very useful with him, as hes prone to going any number of characters at locals that would distort the character usage data (assuming it's reported at all). I think over the last couple months Pit was his most used character which I don't believe has shown up any regionals yet that I'm aware of. A second and smaller issue, is sometimes we don't really have a good sense of who the player is using if they don't talk about it in twitter and don't appear in a lot of recent vods. I think Nurse is a good example of that. All that said to say, I do agree with you on your point about us maybe just needing to do a better job on the narrative. Maybe in these circumstances specify that the player uses a variety of characters and some of the most frequent are x y and z instead of saying x player mains x character. Wiifitkid (talk) 16:56, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
- Character usage in the infobox is supposed to be kept up to date, so if Rokki ends up using Pit a lot more than other characters over a recent substantial timeframe, then that can be noted as his main and other characters downgraded to other accordingly. But yes, the article text should be explaining any complexities with the player's character usage that can't be fully conveyed through the infobox no matter what is done, rather than just saying "this player is known to use a variety of characters". Omega Tyrant 18:27, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
- Keeping rokki up to date would mean switching up the mains orders or dropping adding like every 2-4 weeks. It's just not practical because you can list a main based on usage and there's still probably like a 50 percent chance he doesn't or barely uses that character at the next regional. Just one of those players you can't be accurate with. Wiifitkid (talk) 18:46, April 8, 2023 (EDT)
- Character usage in the infobox is supposed to be kept up to date, so if Rokki ends up using Pit a lot more than other characters over a recent substantial timeframe, then that can be noted as his main and other characters downgraded to other accordingly. But yes, the article text should be explaining any complexities with the player's character usage that can't be fully conveyed through the infobox no matter what is done, rather than just saying "this player is known to use a variety of characters". Omega Tyrant
- Im undecided on whether or not theres enough warrant to change the info box, because of the same reasons you cite. This only affects a small number of player. The only reason I would consider a change is I do think it's misleading to a reader Some players just don't exhibit consistency and are prone to going an entirely another character at another tournament. Take rokki. Isabelle often appears as a top 2 used character and then there will be several events where it's the 5th or 7th most used character at that regional (or not even used). Smash data probably isn't even very useful with him, as hes prone to going any number of characters at locals that would distort the character usage data (assuming it's reported at all). I think over the last couple months Pit was his most used character which I don't believe has shown up any regionals yet that I'm aware of. A second and smaller issue, is sometimes we don't really have a good sense of who the player is using if they don't talk about it in twitter and don't appear in a lot of recent vods. I think Nurse is a good example of that. All that said to say, I do agree with you on your point about us maybe just needing to do a better job on the narrative. Maybe in these circumstances specify that the player uses a variety of characters and some of the most frequent are x y and z instead of saying x player mains x character. Wiifitkid (talk) 16:56, April 8, 2023 (EDT)