Forum:Articles on games...

Forums: Index → Brawl talk → Articles on games...

It's come to my attention that we have articles on games that have been lingering here for a while and need to be eliminated. Examples: Super Mario 64, Super Mario Sunshine, Star Fox: Assault. To be honest, these articles, in terms of giving information, are useless. If a character has a move that comes from a game, then that's what should be mentioned in said character's article. If a character appears in Brawl or Melee as a trophy, then the article is thus useless and should not have ever existed. We've been over this with trophy articles (surprisingly, some of them are still here).

Since that (what I said in parentheses) is true, I also propose that all trophies be merged into one article. Trophies, stickers, and games do not merit their own articles. This is why we have "list" pages. For some reason, there is a list page... and still, trophies have articles. This needs to be fixed. If we can go through with this, the Wiki will be less of a pig sty. I told OmegaTyrant this and he suggested to me that I ask for the opinions of the community, so here I am, with the forum. Go! BNK ^[E|T|C] 03:29, June 29, 2010 (UTC)

Stickers don't need articles. Trophies that are only trophies don't need articles, but if they are also something else (like a stage element), then they can stay. Certain game articles need to go, but important ones can stay. Dr. Pain 99 Talk 03:37, June 29, 2010 (UTC)

I partially agree with you, in that we have too many articles about games. However, games like Kirby and the Amazing Mirror, which have references from Smash, should definitly be kept. Mr. Anon (talk) 04:47, June 29, 2010 (UTC)

More people have to give their opinion on this. We have to set a criteria for game articles, as well as deciding if trophies deserve entire articles and if songs from SSB do as well. Omega Tyrant 03:44, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

I agree with you. I don't really see a need for those articles.--MegaTron1XD 03:49, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

Alrighty. BNK ^[E|T|C] 03:55, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

Alright, here's my take on this. Trophies and stickers don't need their own articles for the sake of existing as trophies, stickers or both, since all the information needed on trophies and stickers is present in the trophy and sticker list articles. However, if there is a character or thing that is of significance for other reasons, Roy Campbell, for example, it should have its own article. On these articles, extensive information that doesn't relate to Smash Bros shouldn't be included, because it's not relevant and can be found elsewhere on the internet. If said character or thing also happens to exist as a trophy or sticker, this should be mentioned in its article and a trophy description, if any, included, because that information is relevant.

Songs, with the exception of maybe the main themes of each of the three Smash games, don't need their own articles either, since all the information needed on songs is on the song list articles. However, these articles are poorly organised and badly need a cleanup, in my opinion.

Game articles should stay or go depending on their significance in the Smash Bros games. For example, Super Mario 64 has contributed quite a few different features to the series, including an item, a stage, a number of moves and animations, and, arguably, the metal character fights during classic mode. However, a lot of the article, like the information about its plot, critical reception, camera system and the like are irrelevant and have no reason to exist on the page. Star Fox Assault, on the other hand, has influenced next to nothing and, in my opinion, really isn't worthy of having its own article here. In my opinion, game articles need to be judged in terms of the number, variety and uniqueness of the contributions they have made to the Smash Bros series. This is because:

• Number - a game that has contributed too few features to Smash Bros will have an article that is too small.
• Variety - a game that has contributed features relevant only to something very specific can be covered in the articles that cover those specific things. For example, if a game contributes only to one character's moveset, the relevant information on that game can be included in the character's article.
• Uniqueness - a game that contains many features present in Smash Bros, which are also present in other games, isn't of any significance. For example, Mario Party 5 has the characters Mario, Luigi, Peach and Bowser, and Boo (who appears on the Luigi's Mansion stage), but this doesn't make it significant, because Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser and Boo also appear in a lot of other, more significant games.

Obviously everyone has a different opinion with regards to the importance of game articles, so each game article page should probably be thoroughly discussed before deleting. That's all for now, folks. Mako Shark (talk) 07:40, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

Oh also, I agree that games that make references to Smash do deserve their own articles. Mako Shark (talk) 07:41, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

Here goes:

1. I agree with Mako's idea on game articles. Games who have big contributions (i.e. DKC was the basis for many movement frames of DK and Diddy, a few attacks, some trophies, stickers, music, items, a couple of stages, even taunts...) should stay. (you're talking to the DKC expert here :D)
2. Stickers definitely don't need articles.
3. Really only the main themes of SSB deserve entire articles- DK Rap is not necessary (in more ways than one, lol)
4. Trophies could get there own articles, I mean, if the character also appeared as a sticker I guess that's notable enough. As well on expanding how exactly to get them. --HavocReaper'48 03:43, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Most things that exist just as trophies and stickers will have all their relevant info covered on the trophy and sticker list pages, so I don't reckon they need their own articles, unless they also appear elsewhere in the game. If someone tried to search for say, Midna, we might create a little redirect page that links the reader to both the sticker and the trophy list pages. On the other hand, some people might consider Midna notable enough for her own article anyway. Mako Shark (talk) 07:03, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

It's time I give my opinion on this. I completely agree with what you said about games and music articles. As for trophies, they should not get their own article unless they appear as elsewhere in SSB other than a sticker. In your example Rose, Midna should not get her own article. It doesn't matter if she is an important character in LoZ:TP, she has no relevance to SSB other than a trophy. We are not the Nintendo Wiki, we are the Smash Wiki. We should not have these detailed articles on characters like Midna who only appear as trophies and the only information we need on them is their trophy information, which is already covered in the List of Trophies page. As such, all of these trophy articles are quite pointless to the Smash Wiki. In conclusion, all game articles should be deleted unless they have SSB references in them or have a substantial amount of contributions to SSB and all trophy articles should be deleted unless the character with the trophy has an appearance in SSB other than a sticker. Omega Tyrant 07:20, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Agreed, except I think it might be a good idea to turn the trophy and sticker article pages into redirects or tiny disambiguation pages, rather than completely eradicating them. So, if someone searches for one of those things, they get pointed toward the information that we do have. Mako Shark (talk) 07:30, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

I have to disagree with that. Again, this is an encyclopedia about Smash Bros., not an encyclopedia on every Nintendo character. If someone wants to learn about Midna, they should go to the Zelda Wiki and search her there, not search her here. As such, we do not need hundreds of pointless redirects to the List of Trophies and List of Stickers pages so we can accommodate for those that are too lazy to type in "List of Trophies" in the search bar. Omega Tyrant 08:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

I reckon the wiki will be more user-friendly with the redirects; I'm happy to create all of them myself. All of them put together would occupy less space than a single image. Mako Shark (talk) 10:19, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

As I said before, the redirects would be pointless and unnecessary. Is making a redirect for all these trophies to a single page be of any use? Simply, they will not and as I said before, we do not need hundreds of pointless and unnecessary redirects to a single page. Omega Tyrant 10:27, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Because, say a new reader is interested in finding out how to get the Dark Samus Trophy, and they search for Dark Samus. They'd be redirected to the trophies page and would be able to find the information they need, rather than to the search results page, which almost never shows the trophy list page near the top of the search results. It can't hurt, can it? Mako Shark (talk) 14:16, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

No, Dark Samus isn't mentioned much elsewhere in the Wiki since she isn't relevant to the Wiki and the List of Trophies page would turn up at the top of the search page. Besides, how much readers are going to search one of these characters just for their trophy information? The answer is, not much. While these redirect pages don't take up much space, they are still wasting space. They're unnecessary and rather impractical. No one should waste their time making all of these redirect pages you proposed just so a few lazy readers don't have to type in "List of Trophies" or find the page through the search option. On this Wiki, we do not allow unnecessary redirects and all of these redirects would be what I consider unnecessary. As such, no one should create hundreds of unnecessary and pointless redirects to a single page to accommodate the search needs of the very few. Omega Tyrant 14:58, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

New proposal - Stopping the madness

We (well, Omega Tyrant) got rid of game articles with barely any or no relevance, but now it has come to my attention that a good percentage of this Wiki's mainspace articles are games. I propose that we merge all games of a series to one article or on the universe pages. For example, we could have an article called Paper Mario (series) and it will have sections describing Super Paper Mario, Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door, and Paper Mario and their relevance to the Super Smash Bros. series. I will need the community to agree with me on this movement, and I would also like all of you to help should you agree. BNK ^[E|T|C] 01:33, July 15, 2010 (UTC)