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SmashWiki talk:Post-Merge Cleanup: Difference between revisions
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Fixing typoed/wikia redlinks to cut down on WantedPages clutter, rm links to to-be-deleted templates
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:Strategies don't really have a place in a character article. Valuable information can be pulled from strategy guides and cited as a reference, however these are not supposed to be instructional guides and we don't want to make the mistake of telling people how to play as though there is a right and wrong way to do it. We should be reporting ''fact'' not inferences based on fact. As to list form, it's not how the information is presented that makes it neutral or not; it's what is being said. Adding a bullet point beside a biased statement doesn't remove its bias. It's best to use your judgment as writers to present the information fairly and fluidly; the format that it takes is a personal preference, I suppose. --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 17:10, 8 August 2008 (UTC) | :Strategies don't really have a place in a character article. Valuable information can be pulled from strategy guides and cited as a reference, however these are not supposed to be instructional guides and we don't want to make the mistake of telling people how to play as though there is a right and wrong way to do it. We should be reporting ''fact'' not inferences based on fact. As to list form, it's not how the information is presented that makes it neutral or not; it's what is being said. Adding a bullet point beside a biased statement doesn't remove its bias. It's best to use your judgment as writers to present the information fairly and fluidly; the format that it takes is a personal preference, I suppose. --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 17:10, 8 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
::I disagree with that sentiment (ugh@not having typed for a week) — wikis are the perfect places for guides. They allow for collaboration, or rather, what the community deems the best way to play a character, thusly removing the bias inherent in any one writers' guide. However, I may be on the wrong tack here — you may simply be saying that this information should ''not'' be in the main character articles but rather in subarticles, such as [[Roy strategy guide]] or [[Marth guide (SSBM)]].<br />Otherwise, looks good. Perhaps a fully drafted manual of style as well as other supporting guidelines, such as the talk page guideline, are in order, rather than the pathetic one currently in place. --[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] ([[User talk:Sky2042|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|c]] · [ | ::I disagree with that sentiment (ugh@not having typed for a week) — wikis are the perfect places for guides. They allow for collaboration, or rather, what the community deems the best way to play a character, thusly removing the bias inherent in any one writers' guide. However, I may be on the wrong tack here — you may simply be saying that this information should ''not'' be in the main character articles but rather in subarticles, such as <nowiki>[[Roy strategy guide]] or [[Marth guide (SSBM)]]</nowiki>.<br />Otherwise, looks good. Perhaps a fully drafted manual of style as well as other supporting guidelines, such as the talk page guideline, are in order, rather than the pathetic one currently in place. --[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] ([[User talk:Sky2042|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|c]] · [http://www.wowpedia.org/User:Sky2042 w]) 05:54, 12 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
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#Why were the tilt moves changes to '''strong side''' or whatever? The entire SSB community uses the word tilt. Since there's no official name for it afaik, why change it and confuse everyone? | #Why were the tilt moves changes to '''strong side''' or whatever? The entire SSB community uses the word tilt. Since there's no official name for it afaik, why change it and confuse everyone? | ||
#Audio section. Was this removed because of the subjectivity? I don't really care about this section (unlike the other4), am just merely inquisitive. | #Audio section. Was this removed because of the subjectivity? I don't really care about this section (unlike the other4), am just merely inquisitive. | ||
The article I have fixed up to the best of my ability with my limited knowledge can be found at | The article I have fixed up to the best of my ability with my limited knowledge can be found at User:Shadowcrest/Zelda. Any suggestions/explanations made either here or on that talk would be great. --[[User:Shadowcrest|<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest</font>]] 20:50, 13 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
:You've got some good points. The big reason I got rid of the Special Movements sections for the time being is that part of the point of this was to demonstrate that less is more. The articles were getting too cluttered with lots of random crap that was being added (i.e. Snake's Codec, User:SuperBobWhoCantPlaySmash's combos, etc.). By removing those section, I thought it would be a good way to demonstrate the new ideas. Once the fighter page format is standaradized, I plan to go into the back-logs and reinsert the ''relevant'' information that got cut. At the present, I wanted to give the most important information, and as this is a fighting game, attacks and attributes get regulated there. As for the Changes from Melee to Brawl, yes they should be added back in. However, I don't like them at the top of the article. The articles are supposed to deal with the characters as they appear in each game. Opening with discussion of the previous game, then, is counter-productive to the purpose of the article. I would suggest one of two spots for that section: Either at the bottom of the Attributes section (below Taunts) as a level three header (<nowiki>===Changes from Melee to Brawl===</nowiki>) or after the Subspace Emissary section as a level 2 header (<nowiki>==Changes from Melee to Brawl==</nowiki>). Lets get some opinions on this before going any further. [[User:Clarinet Hawk|Clarinet Hawk]] <small>([[User talk:Clarinet Hawk|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Clarinet Hawk|contributions]])</small> 21:01, 13 August 2008 (UTC) | :You've got some good points. The big reason I got rid of the Special Movements sections for the time being is that part of the point of this was to demonstrate that less is more. The articles were getting too cluttered with lots of random crap that was being added (i.e. Snake's Codec, User:SuperBobWhoCantPlaySmash's combos, etc.). By removing those section, I thought it would be a good way to demonstrate the new ideas. Once the fighter page format is standaradized, I plan to go into the back-logs and reinsert the ''relevant'' information that got cut. At the present, I wanted to give the most important information, and as this is a fighting game, attacks and attributes get regulated there. As for the Changes from Melee to Brawl, yes they should be added back in. However, I don't like them at the top of the article. The articles are supposed to deal with the characters as they appear in each game. Opening with discussion of the previous game, then, is counter-productive to the purpose of the article. I would suggest one of two spots for that section: Either at the bottom of the Attributes section (below Taunts) as a level three header (<nowiki>===Changes from Melee to Brawl===</nowiki>) or after the Subspace Emissary section as a level 2 header (<nowiki>==Changes from Melee to Brawl==</nowiki>). Lets get some opinions on this before going any further. [[User:Clarinet Hawk|Clarinet Hawk]] <small>([[User talk:Clarinet Hawk|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Clarinet Hawk|contributions]])</small> 21:01, 13 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
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:Does the Zelda article look alright to you guys? Before I C+P it over the mainspace version, I'd like to make sure I did everything well enough to be mainspace material. --[[User:Shadowcrest|<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest</font>]] 22:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC) | :Does the Zelda article look alright to you guys? Before I C+P it over the mainspace version, I'd like to make sure I did everything well enough to be mainspace material. --[[User:Shadowcrest|<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest</font>]] 22:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
::Well, the difference between the wavedash and the tilt is strictly the audience. It was more an example of the difference in attitudes between new Brawl players bowing to Nintendo's every word and veteran Melee players who run the communities and will eventually have the last word. :^) | ::Well, the difference between the wavedash and the tilt is strictly the audience. It was more an example of the difference in attitudes between new Brawl players bowing to Nintendo's every word and veteran Melee players who run the communities and will eventually have the last word. :^) | ||
::Your | ::Your Zelda article looks pretty good. I would suggest bolding things like "Dash attack" and "Forward Smash" in the Moveset section. And they could use some damage ranges as well. Speaking of which, there really ought to be another column in [[Template:Special Moves]] for damage. Just in case you're looking for a quick glance at that information without having to open up an entire article on [[Nayru's Love]], ya know. I might also suggest that "exclusive stickers" and "stickers that can only be used by Zelda or a few other characters including her" aren't the same thing. But otherwise, that's excellent work! --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 15:51, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
:::Alright, bolding isn't a problem. | :::Alright, bolding isn't a problem. | ||
:::Damage ranges- no problem, but what should be done about things like Nayru's Love that hit multiple times? Some knockback occurs for each hit (I think), so it's not likely someone will be in it for all the hits. Should we assume all of them hit and list accordingly? | :::Damage ranges- no problem, but what should be done about things like Nayru's Love that hit multiple times? Some knockback occurs for each hit (I think), so it's not likely someone will be in it for all the hits. Should we assume all of them hit and list accordingly? | ||
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:::#I'm going to use this order for smashes/aerials: Forward(side?), back (if applicable), up, down. --[[User:Shadowcrest|<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest</font>]] 21:31, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | :::#I'm going to use this order for smashes/aerials: Forward(side?), back (if applicable), up, down. --[[User:Shadowcrest|<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest</font>]] 21:31, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
::::Attacks with multiple hits still have a damage range, even if it's from 1% to 35%. The idea is just to include information about the minimum and maximum amount of damage you can incur by being hit by any one of the attacks. I wasn't aware that exclusive stickers didn't apply to every character, but if that's the case, it might make more sense to have "Exclusive Stickers" only on the characters where it's actually true and then have separate pages for [[List of Zelda stickers]] much like the trophy argument. | ::::Attacks with multiple hits still have a damage range, even if it's from 1% to 35%. The idea is just to include information about the minimum and maximum amount of damage you can incur by being hit by any one of the attacks. I wasn't aware that exclusive stickers didn't apply to every character, but if that's the case, it might make more sense to have "Exclusive Stickers" only on the characters where it's actually true and then have separate pages for <nowiki>[[List of Zelda stickers]]</nowiki> much like the trophy argument. | ||
::::Captain Falcon's event matches section is too trivial to keep. There's plenty of places where event match info is being documented elsewhere in the wiki and it really just doesn't have any bearing on who the character is as a fighter. Same goes with trophy description--we'll probably address that per the discussion below. | ::::Captain Falcon's event matches section is too trivial to keep. There's plenty of places where event match info is being documented elsewhere in the wiki and it really just doesn't have any bearing on who the character is as a fighter. Same goes with trophy description--we'll probably address that per the discussion below. | ||
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Which way should we go about this? [[User:Erik the Appreciator|Erik Jensen]] <b><sup>([[User talk:Erik the Appreciator|Appreciate me here!]])</sup></b> 20:15, 14 August 2008 (UTC) | Which way should we go about this? [[User:Erik the Appreciator|Erik Jensen]] <b><sup>([[User talk:Erik the Appreciator|Appreciate me here!]])</sup></b> 20:15, 14 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
:[[List of Kirby trophies]], or [[Kirby trophies]], as you prefer. ;P<br />However, you do bring up the good point that all redirects not being categorized might be a bad idea. Something for me to consider (as I've been doing since I read it). --[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] ([[User talk:Sky2042|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|c]] · [ | :<nowiki>[[List of Kirby trophies]], or [[Kirby trophies]]</nowiki>, as you prefer. ;P<br />However, you do bring up the good point that all redirects not being categorized might be a bad idea. Something for me to consider (as I've been doing since I read it). --[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] ([[User talk:Sky2042|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|c]] · [http://www.wowpedia.org/User:Sky2042 w]) 21:51, 14 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
:I don't really understand how trophies being in the main character articles has anything to do with categorizing redirects...(?) How does not categorizing redirects mean that we have to create trophy-specific articles? I mean, currently with the trophy descriptions in the character page, why doesn't [[Wedding Bowser]] just redirect to [[Bowser]]? And if we end up creating [[List of Bowser trophies]], what's wrong with having Wedding Bowser redirect to that? And what does that have to do with categories at all? Am I missing something here?? --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 15:58, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | :I don't really understand how trophies being in the main character articles has anything to do with categorizing redirects...(?) How does not categorizing redirects mean that we have to create trophy-specific articles? I mean, currently with the trophy descriptions in the character page, why doesn't [[Wedding Bowser]] just redirect to [[Bowser]]? And if we end up creating <nowiki>[[List of Bowser trophies]]</nowiki>, what's wrong with having Wedding Bowser redirect to that? And what does that have to do with categories at all? Am I missing something here?? --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 15:58, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
::If the decision's to make pages like [[List of trophies about Samus]] and [[List of trophies about Kirby]] ("List of Kirby trophies" would make it sound too much like a list of trophies about the Kirby ''universe'' anyway), that'd square away well enough the issue I was thinking about. It's a third-option I hadn't thought of. =P [[User:Erik the Appreciator|Erik Jensen]] <b><sup>([[User talk:Erik the Appreciator|Appreciate me here!]])</sup></b> 18:04, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | ::If the decision's to make pages like <nowiki>[[List of trophies about Samus]] and [[List of trophies about Kirby]]</nowiki> ("List of Kirby trophies" would make it sound too much like a list of trophies about the Kirby ''universe'' anyway), that'd square away well enough the issue I was thinking about. It's a third-option I hadn't thought of. =P [[User:Erik the Appreciator|Erik Jensen]] <b><sup>([[User talk:Erik the Appreciator|Appreciate me here!]])</sup></b> 18:04, 15 August 2008 (UTC) | ||
==Fighters' Names Cleanup== | ==Fighters' Names Cleanup== | ||
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If you plan to merge the charcter's pros and cons in the attributes sections. Please do it for every characters or don't do it at all.--[[User:Mr Alex|Mr Alex]] ([[User talk:Mr Alex|T]]) 16:18, October 22, 2009 (UTC) | If you plan to merge the charcter's pros and cons in the attributes sections. Please do it for every characters or don't do it at all.--[[User:Mr Alex|Mr Alex]] ([[User talk:Mr Alex|T]]) 16:18, October 22, 2009 (UTC) | ||
:I'm trying to work on it, but I've been busy recently. It'll get done eventually, though. [[User:Enigmatic Mr. L|<span style="color:Green">'''Enigmatic'''</span>]] [[User talk:Enigmatic Mr. L|<span style="color:Black">'''Mr.'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Enigmatic Mr. L|<span style="color:Black">'''L'''</span>]] 20:03, October 22, 2009 (UTC) | |||