Editing Talk:Up throw Rest

'''Delete''' can some one confirm de validity of this technique??
:'''No Delete''' Can someone confirm the validity of the "Deathly Combo," "Z-Aerial," and "Z-Barrier?" I'm afraid that you can't delete real technique pages when your own are not correct. [[User:Teamrocketspy621|Teamrocketspy621]] 12:14, November 20, 2007 (EST)

This is a well-known technique among Jigglypuff players. No delete.--[[User:Nealdt|nealdt]] 12:50, November 20, 2007 (EST)

<s>'''Delete''' - I've never heard this terminology before and I don't see how "up-throw to rest" doesn't just get mentioned offhandedly in the [[Jigglypuff (SSBM)|Jigglypuff]] article. Really, how much can you say about this tactic? Enough for an article? I doubt it. --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 16:12, November 20, 2007 (EST)</s>
:'''Keep''' - Changed my mind; MaskedMarth is right. --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 13:49, January 13, 2008 (EST)
:Hmmm... you're right. I've never heard of it before I found this article, but heck, it sounds as valid as the [[Wall of Pain]] to me. But what do I know? XD [[User:Teamrocketspy621|Teamrocketspy621]] 16:33, November 20, 2007 (EST)
::MMMM maybe you said that because zinnamon say that it was wrong, and because he has been wrong before you thought you will be right if you say the opposite than him. I'm right? (Zinnamon, please, sing your post with four tildes <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> --[[User:Fandangox|Fandangox]] 16:49, November 20, 2007 (EST)
:::No no, I make my own opinions. Zinnamon doesn't exactly have a lot of influence on what I believe is right and wrong. --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 02:47, November 21, 2007 (EST)

'''No Delete''' I've seen the term used a lot on SWF and GFAQs, and it still works; DI just makes it slightly harder. Then again, what ''doesn't'' DI make harder? [[User:BurningCrusader777|NeonCrusader]] 23:01, November 20, 2007 (EST)
::No, RJM I was refering to teamrocketspy621, he changed his opinion whe you gave yours. --[[User:Fandangox|Fandangox]] 13:33, November 22, 2007 (EST)
:::I changed my opinion because Zinnamon wanted to delete an article on what could be a valid tactic when his technique articles aren't exactly useful. Lightshielding, using Z for aerials, and One-hit KOs weren't exactly made/discovered/named by Zinnamon. However, Zinnamon and RJM may be right; the Space Animal Slayer might not exist. ''That'' is why I changed my opinion; because Randall > Me. [[User:Teamrocketspy621|Teamrocketspy621]] 15:18, November 22, 2007 (EST)
::::That's exactly why I say before, only that I didn'y say it before.--[[User:Fandangox|Fandangox]] 16:21, November 22, 2007 (EST)

I say merge. Put it under Jigglypuff's techniques. Do the same with other articles of this type. --[[User:Oxico|Oxico]] 15:34, December 13, 2007 (EST)

I agree.  Merge.  Who would look outside of Jigglypuff's moves for Jigglypuff's moves?    
Seriously.

'''No delete''' I think it's also worth mentioning that, unlike many other combos, this one has 1) a name, and 2) a big influence on the way people see Jiggly vs. Space Animal matchups.  People still think Jiggly counters Fox and Falco because of the SAS!  This is one of the best-known combos in the game and I believe it deserves even more coverage. {{User:MaskedMarth/sig}} 11:54, January 13, 2008 (EST)

'''Do Not Merge''' Space Animal Slayer refers to any character that is good against spacies, not just jigglypuff or anyone that is good themselves against fox, falco, or wolf. Do not Merge lol. And yea, this technique is valid, enough people know of it in the competitve worldKoRo TeH BeAr 00:04, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

:This article has nothing to do with any character other than Jigglypuff, so your reasoning is pretty much null and void but I still agree that this should not be merged. It seems like it would be a bigger stain on a character's article, which shouldn't be confused with a walkthrough/FAQ on every aspect of their play, than it is an article on its own.   --<font color="000023">'''[[User:Randall00|RJM]]'''</font> <sup>''[[User talk:Randall00|Talk]]''</sup> 01:10, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

*Don't merge this article with Jigglypuff because there are probably other characters that can [[Space Animal Slayer|Space Animal Slay]]; we just need to find out which ones. Also, there might not be any way to [[Space Animal Slayer|Space Animal Slay]] in Brawl, and isolate it from [[Jigglypuff (SSBB)|Jigglypuff]]'s article. [[User:Reptiliusofpeace|Reptiliusofpeace]] ([[User talk:Reptiliusofpeace|talk]]) 17:41, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

'''Comment''' it's worth noting that historically the Space Animal Slayer referred specifically to Jigglypuff's uthrow-rest combo, and not to any other. It could have branched out to have a wider meaning, but I haven't seen it at GameFAQs, at least. I think it's more accurate just to mention Jigglypuff in this article and not bring in any "an SAS could be discovered for another character" business. [[User:MaskedMarth|MaskedMarth]] ([[User talk:MaskedMarth|talk]]) 23:28, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

== I think there's a better name for this technique ==

In the modern melee community, I have never heard this technique be called "The Space Animal Slayer;" the technique is more commonly referred to as the "Hunger Strike" due to the unmatched level of consistency and precision {{Sm|Hungrybox}} displayed when using the move. 

Furthermore there are many variants of the technique in addition to up throw -> rest. The most notable variant is the platform tech variant, wherein you do up throw below and platform then up air as they tech. Of course after that rest. Unlike the traditional hunger strike this version is guaranteed because the up air prevents the opponent from teching again due the 20 frame window where you can't tech. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCok4JWNcss#t=22m35s It can be seen here]

The other notable variant takes the form of trip/knockdown -> jab reset -> rest. A rest after a jab reset is also guaranteed, but setting up the opportunity to jab may be problematic. The most common ways is to do a falling pound or  space a bair/uair. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks2ot_ICXWI#t=16m58s Here's an example]. 

So yeah, rename the page to "Hunger Strike" ?--<span style="background-color:#6d84e1;border:3px solid silver">[[User:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:silver">'''Brian'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:black">Don't try me!</span>]]</sup>[[File:Falco.gif|link=|27px]]</span> 23:49, 12 November 2012 (EST)
:The first page of Googling <code>"hunger strike" site:smashboards.com</code> brought pretty much no related results. <code>"space animal slayer" site:smashboards.com</code> not only did much better, but just putting "space animal slayer" into the bar caused Google to suggest adding "jigglypuff". That's all I know. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] Da Bomb 11:58, 13 November 2012 (EST)
:Oh I'd like to add that you should go ahead and add that first variant you mentioned to the article; I don't think the second variant is related enough to be considered the same thing, since it doesn't look like a space animal-specific thing and has no up throw at all. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Chronicler 21:16, 13 November 2012 (EST)
'''Oppose''' If Google proves anything, it's that space animal slayer is the recognized name. --[[User:RoyboyX|<font color="red">'''Roy'''</font><font color="gray">'''boy'''</font><font color="darkred">'''X'''</font>]] [[User talk:RoyboyX|''<span style="color:brown;">'''Talk'''</span>'']] 20:15, 15 November 2012 (EST)

'''Oppose''' I haven't heard of Hunger strike until now. And I clearly have heard of Space animal slayer many more times so keep. [[User:Dots|Dots]] [[User talk:Dots|The]] [[Special:Contributions/Dots|Republic]] [[File:NintenNESsprite.png|19px]] 20:23, 15 November 2012 (EST)

'''Support''' Watch the melee streams then, well known commentators like prog, dogysamich, and waffles will call it either hunger strike or mangoCombo or mangoRape, with the hunger strike being the most used. No commentator I have heard or NorCal smasher I have spoken too calls it the Space Animal Slayer, but rather 1 of the above 3 names.--<span style="background-color:#6d84e1;border:3px solid silver">[[User:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:silver">'''Brian'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:black">Don't try me!</span>]]</sup>[[File:Falco.gif|link=|27px]]</span> 20:50, 15 November 2012 (EST)
:Just because commentators like using Hunger strike doesn't mean it's the more used and recognised term. They're commentating, and understandably, they're going to be using names that are more fitting to commentary, i.e. something that is easier to say, as well as is more "exciting" (which applies to Hunger strike and those other Mango names you mentioned). Give us written documentation of those being the most used terms; "commentators say it" is not stronger evidence than the google results Toomai provided. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 21:48, 15 November 2012 (EST)

'''Oppose''' Hunger strike should redirect to this if it's to be used.--[[User:Starman125|Starman125]] ([[User talk:Starman125|talk]]) 22:06, 15 November 2012 (EST)

I agree with starman125 since thats a compromis.[[User:Brawls of fury|Brawls of fury]] ([[User talk:Brawls of fury|talk]]) 22:27, 15 November 2012 (EST)

Anyone else? --[[User:RoyboyX|<font color="red">'''Roy'''</font><font color="gray">'''boy'''</font><font color="darkred">'''X'''</font>]] [[User talk:RoyboyX|''<span style="color:brown;">'''Talk'''</span>'']] 13:49, 17 November 2012 (EST)

I've never heard of the Hunger Strike, but I've not been active or following the scene in the last few years. That said, Space Animal Slayer was THE term that was used for this for the years that I worked this site and followed Melee.  [[User:Clarinet Hawk|Clarinet Hawk]] <small>([[User talk:Clarinet Hawk|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Clarinet Hawk|contributions]])</small> 23:45, 24 November 2012 (EST)


have never heard anyone refer to this as the 'space animal slayer' or 'hunger strike', be it in tournament, on netplay, a fest, or by anyone -- either in person or on the internet alike. since joining the community in 2015 i've explicitly heard up-throw rest named as 'up-throw rest' -- including by PR puff players 'round the new england states.  [[User:Fats|Fats]] ([[User talk:Fats|talk]]) 09:19, 19 November 2018 (EST)

==Rename to "Up throw rest"==
Prior to this page I have never heard of the terms space animal slayer or hunger strike. Doing some research, it seems like "space animal slayer" was somewhat used on Smashboards from 2007-2008 with a few more references following those yers. "Hunger strike" seems to have been a commentator nickname for the move that apparently began seeing some use in local scenes (e.g. NorCal). Either way, neither of these terms have been used commonly in years. I have always heard the term "up throw rest" and nothing else. I suggest we move it to such to avoid confusion like this [https://twitter.com/Pipsqueak_TV/status/1437160346331062274 Twitter post]. (lol) [[User:SenorMexicano|<span style="color:#850FFA; text-shadow: 0px 0px 3px green">'''Señor'''</span> <span style="color:#850FFA;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px green">'''Mexicano'''</span>]] ''[[User talk:SenorMexicano|<span style="color:lightpurple;text-shadow:0px 0px 2px lightgreen">(talk)</span>]]'' 18:08, September 12, 2021 (EDT)

'''Support''': "Space animal slayer" was always an antiquated name I never seen actually used outside this wiki, while being an awful mouthful to say/type at that, and while "Hunger Strike" is a much better name for actually saying/typing it, it was of niche usage then and I haven't really heard of it being used in years. Best to go with the basic name that's quick to say and is predominantly used.  <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 18:14, September 12, 2021 (EDT)

Bumping this after it got lost in the Riptide shuffle, but I'm going to move for a fast pass since this seems pretty cut-and-dry, and the conversation on Discord thoroughly supported it. So if there's no good objection in 24 hours, this move will be going through. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 00:48, September 13, 2021 (EDT)
	You aren't logged in. While it's not a requirement to create an account, doing so makes it a lot easier to keep track of your edits and a lot harder to confuse you with someone else. If you edit without being logged in, your IP address will be recorded in the page's edit history.
	Log in	Create account
Latest revision		Your text
Line 65:		Line 65:

	Bumping this after it got lost in the Riptide shuffle, but I'm going to move for a fast pass since this seems pretty cut-and-dry, and the conversation on Discord thoroughly supported it. So if there's no good objection in 24 hours, this move will be going through. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant\|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant\|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 00:48, September 13, 2021 (EDT)		Bumping this after it got lost in the Riptide shuffle, but I'm going to move for a fast pass since this seems pretty cut-and-dry, and the conversation on Discord thoroughly supported it. So if there's no good objection in 24 hours, this move will be going through. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant\|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant\|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 00:48, September 13, 2021 (EDT)
	:'''Support'''. [[User:Cookies and Creme\|<span style="font-family: Georgia;color: black;">Cookies</span>]][[File:CnC Signature.png\|20px]][[User talk:Cookies and Creme\|<span style="font-family: Georgia; color: black;">Creme</span>]] 01:13, September 13, 2021 (EDT)
Insert common text
Signature	~~~~
Symbols	£ ¥ ° ± × ÷ € ≈ ≠ ≤ ≥
Diacritics	À Á Â Ã Ä Å Æ Ç È É Ê Ë Ì Í Î Ï Ð Ñ Ò Ó Ô Õ Ö Ø Œ Ù Ú Û Ü Ý Þ ß à á â ã ä å æ ç è é ê ë ì í î ï ð ñ ò ó ô õ ö ø œ ù ú û ü ý þ ÿ
Wikitext	[] [[]] \| [[Category:]] [[File:]] #REDIRECT: [[]] {\| \|- \|\| \|}
Templates	{{cleanup}} {{image}} {{reflist}} {{stub}} {{d}} {{delete}}
Formatting	<!----> <br> <code></code> <gallery></gallery> <nowiki></nowiki> <ref></ref> <references/> {{#widget:YouTube\|id=}}
Substitution	<includeonly></includeonly> <noinclude></noinclude>