Editing Talk:Ganondorf (SSBB)

==Proof==
proof plz [[User:WaluigiIsAwesome|WaluigiIsAwesome]] 22:42, August 3, 2007 (EDT)

[http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200708/N07.0802.1741.54921.htm], GameInformer. [[User:Magiciandude|Magiciandude]] 00:53, August 4, 2007 (EDT)
::is Game Informer a valid site for info? i've never heard of them before. [[User:Silverdragon706|FyreNWater]] 03:25, August 4, 2007 (EDT)
:::Game Informer is a video game magazine, and yes, they're one of the more reliable gaming related press guys out there. I prefer them to GamePro and EGM. -[[User:Thores|Thores]]
::::They're the biggest gaming magazine in the world, by a large margin. And Anouma (the guy who sent in the Ganondorf and Shiek models the Sakurai, and the creator of many Zelda games) never said Ganondorf was playable. So this article should be deleted. Actually, no it should stay, to save us some time of creating it, since no one doubts his chances. Johnknight1 13:11, 7 October, 2007 (PCT)

== Ganondorf's Sticker Power-Ups Should Be Added! ==

I just saw that Lucario has his own sticker Power-ups section. Considering that there are stickers that affect Ganondorf's Darkness abilities and no one else has darkness abilities to power up with stickers, I think someone should add them! Come to think of it, why stop there? Someone could add the character-specific stickers to every other character article!--[[User:King Dedede Kirby|King Dedede Kirby]] 21:44, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

==It Is Written...==

Only Link can defeat Ganon! - [[User:GalaxiaD|GalaxiaD]] 01:15, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
:Join me, Link! And I will make '''your face''' the GRRRREATEST in Koridai! - [[User:Gargomon251|Gargomon251]] 20:33, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Or else you will '''DIE!''' - [[User:GalaxiaD|GalaxiaD]] 23:20, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Damn, D, you seem to love to post random things that don't pertain to anything at all. Thanks again though.  -FlagLapelOnMyChest <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:FlagLapelOnMyChest|FlagLapelOnMyChest]] ([[User talk:FlagLapelOnMyChest|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/FlagLapelOnMyChest|contribs]]) 14:44, 5 May 2008 (UTC)</small>

== His combo ability ==

After viewing this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECgwnzdkw5g I think some of his cons should be changed. What do you guy's think?([[User:Fossilgojira|Fossilgojira]] ([[User talk:Fossilgojira|talk]]) 00:24, 25 May 2008 (UTC))

==Recruiting==
'''OK all who are willing. I need lots of help. I need all the moveset to look all alike. I need people willing to help! If you choose to accept this challenge, use [[Meta Knight (SSBB)|Meta Knight]]'s moveset as a perfect example. If you want to help the cause, leave your username under the category on my userpage called "Recruiting". This message is also there. Let's fix these movesets.''' --[[User:Oxico|Oxico]] ([[User talk:Oxico|talk]]) 20:49, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

==Facial expressions==
Why is it that Ganon shows no facial expressions when being attacked, attacking or knocked around (such as the case with Link, Wario and Mario)? Only time I've seen some emotion from him is from his crossed-arm laughing victory posture. [[User:ILoveWario|ILoveWario]] ([[User talk:ILoveWario|talk]]) 14:16, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
:When he's standing still, he smiles out of pity for his opponent. When he's moving about, he shows no emotion. When he's attacking someone, he ignites the purple flames of his rage, and also has a serious face. When he's hit, he does the little "One eye wide open, other eye closed/squinting, grimace" thing that most other human characters, and King Dedede, do. [[User:Cafinator|Cafinator]] ([[User talk:Cafinator|talk]]) 16:35, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

== Gannon + Ice Climbers No longer hold the world record in HRC ==

Yeah just look at this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy35k-5gK0

That needs to be edited on Gannon's page that his record was broken.

== His sword ==
"Ganondorf is one of the only characters who carries a holstered weapon but never uses it. The others being Captain Falcon, Sheik and Snake. "

What the heck is a "holstered weapon" ?? [[User:Metalink187|Metalink187]] ([[User talk:Metalink187|talk]]) 21:40, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Carried. e.g: On a strap. <span style="color:steelblue">[[User:Alex25|I'm Alex25, King of Randomness!]] [[User talk:Alex25|Say Hi to me!]] [[Special:Contributions/Alex25|Random stuff!]]</span> 21:44, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

There is no time! Your sword is enough

== "Predictable recovery" ==

Why not just say "atrocious and predictable" recovery in the opening paragraph, even if you can predict him, more often than not you don't have to do anything to prevent him from getting the ledge.

== "Sparta Kick" ==

''or another character with a kick similar to Ganondorf's''. Who ever is so anal about adding this, please stop. No one has a kick similar to Ganondorf, and even if they did this article is about Ganondorf, not another character. --[[User:Gannonbanned|Gannonbanned]] ([[User talk:Gannonbanned|talk]]) 13:53, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Also whoever keeps adding ""(Often represen ted by Ganondorf)'' please stop. No one else makes 300 parodies with another character other then Ganondorf as Leonidas. No one else has anything similar to a sparta kick at all.
--[[User:Gannonbanned|Gannonbanned]] ([[User talk:Gannonbanned|talk]]) 13:53, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Not all Sparta vids use Ganondorf. I suggest you look for more vids than looking at just one.

Perhaps in Melee, but not in Brawl. Add a link to my talk page that is a Sparta parody that doesn't use Ganondorf, made at least one month ago (To prove you didn't just make it) and I will stop this edit war. Until then however I will continue to revert it. --[[User:Gannonbanned|Gannonbanned]] ([[User talk:Gannonbanned|talk]]) 13:52, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== He could use a sword but he doesn't cuz he's a beast ==

His third taunt ganondorf pulls out his sword(which i may say is an awsome sword)but instead of fighting you with it he puts it back and continues to pwn you with his bare hands because he is awsome like that. His attacks are ridicuously powerful everything from his worlock punch to his ganoncide to his spike he is awsome and he doesn't use a sword to do it like link cuz ganondorf has balls.

Snake has a gun, and so does Captain Falcon, to my knowledge. [[Special:Contributions/79.75.167.128|79.75.167.128]] 09:08, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

== Tier list? ha what kinda of noob would eat that garbage? ==
Lets see here. Ganondorf's weaknesses according to you: 
#Projectiles: I use Ganondorf and I've never had any problems with projectiles, that's what a shield is for, duh!
#I've owned friends using Meta Knight with Ganondorf, all you have to do is change your style for the speedier, quicker characters. Simple Baiting works fine.
#Mobility: running fast has nothing to do with good mobility, I use him and I don't have any problem out manuevering my opponents. Unlike Bowser GANONDORF can combo!
#Predictable recovery? Bull if you mean that Edge Guard thing that's still not a problem if your taking the fight to them. Also EVERY recovery is predictable then! Cause after all it's a recovery ain't it? It's used to recover! oh wow like predictability has stopped you from getting back on stage. especially when you use other moves with it.
#Sluggish moves? Ya, so? That has nothing to do with being a bad character. You just need to use them better!
#And as for match-ups if Ganondorf's used by a noob then of course he won't stand a chance!
Freaking arses trying to make excuses for their lack of skill... it pisses me off... <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:70.66.219.126|70.66.219.126]] ([[User talk:70.66.219.126|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/70.66.219.126|contribs]]) 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)</small>
:Firstly, sign your comments using four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>). Secondly, #1 comes out as "1. 1" not "1.". Now, onto the main topic of discussion. You're not a Professional Smasher, or even a Semi-Professional Smasher, so the tier lists, matchups and attributes have no relevance to how you play the game. But, seeing as you have actually raised points, I think it only fair to address them.
:His ability to deal with projectiles, his mobility and his sluggish moves are all poor compared to the other characters. He's extremely slow on the ground and in the air, his jumps are all very short, and most of his moves has large amount of lag. You might have "owned" friends who play as Meta Knight using Ganondorf, but that proves nothing. You're clearly just better than them at ''Brawl''. Ganondorf's recovery is predictable when compared to the other characters. For example, Meta Knight can use all of his specials as recovery moves, and they can all be used in most situations. Ganondorf's recovery isn't just predictable, it's very short, and only two of his moves can be used to recover, neither of which go very far and both of which leave him helpless. The fact that he's so heavy doesn't help. Ganondorf can't combo - no one can in ''Brawl''. A combo is when a character is hit by an attack and is still in hitstun when they are hit again. The hitstun in ''Brawl'' is far too low for there to be any combos. It's a common misconception. "You just need to use them better", "trying to make excuses for their lack of skill" and "if Ganondorf's used by a noob" - the tier list, matchups and attributes are based on ''competitive play''. We don't just have a SmashWiki poll every now and then to decide the new tier list, or work out the matchups. We get them from the [[SmashBoards]], and they are worked out by top professional Smashers who, I have to say, know the game far better than you, and are far more skilful at it. Anyway, given his many obvious weaknesses, it's fairly safe to say that Ganondorf is objectively a worse character than Meta Knight. There's not really much room for debate... '''''<span style="font-family:Arial;">[[User:PenguinofDeath|<font color="silver">Penguin</font>]][[User talk:PenguinofDeath|<font color="gray">of</font>]][[Special:Contributions/PenguinofDeath|<font color="silver">Death</font>]]</span>''''' 02:05, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
(Im not that guy but i am a ganondorf player). Ganondorfs recovery can be very predictable but it is not as short as pepole think [[User:Oni Dark Link|<font color="66FFFF">Oni]]</font> [[Special:Editcount/Oni Dark Link|<font color="#7F007F">Dark ]]</font> [[User:Oni Dark Link/ Series evaluation|<font color="#007A00">Link]]</font> 20:09, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

I agree with the guy above me, Ganon's recovery is not too bad as most people think. And Im serious about this, Ganon can do more then you think. coming from a moderate Ganon user. Ganon for top tier!(obviously not gonna happen but hey, I can dream.)And Ganon is way better then CF in my honest opinion. Oh well, cant mess with the tier list.[[User:VideoGameBoy|VideoGameBoy]] ([[User talk:VideoGameBoy|talk]]) 20:45, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

== Sound clip from Melee? ==

I have a GCN controller, but I prefer using the Wiimote/Nunchuck combo. That being said, when you select Ganondorf, does anybody else notice that his little yell that plays on the Wiimote speaker is from Melee, despite him having a different voice actor in Brawl? And I'm not making this up; go listen to it on Brawl then go to Sound Test in Melee. I believe it's Ganondorf clip #17, but not entirely certain. The only thing I'm curious about is, does this seem worthy of adding to Trivia, or does it matter? I mean, it's got a note in there about ''300 parodies'', so why not... [[User:Aerandir|Aerandir]] ([[User talk:Aerandir|talk]]) 19:48, February 1, 2010 (UTC)
:This is also true for several other characters (that they have a ''Melee'' sound effect for the Wiimote).  Sure, note it. [[User:Miles.oppenheimer|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles.oppenheimer|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 22:35, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

== Pummel Speed ==
Well since you're so insistent about Ganondorf's pummel being very slow, I went and did some testing. Sure enough, my testing proved my point that his pummel is slow for a 2% pummel, but it is faster than the majority of 3% pummels. I went on training mode and did five trials against a 100% opponent. Here I'll list the most hits they gotten in the five trials before the opponent broke free. While this isn't the most thorough testing (I would have to test against 999%) and I did not test every character, the results from this small test are enough to prove my point.

Ganondorf was able to get in 9 hits at maximum before the opponent broke free but how does this compare to other pummels?  These characters were only able to get 7 hits with their pummel, Mario, Luigi, Zelda, King Dedede, Ivysaur, and Mr G&W. These characters were able to 8 hits with their pummel, Bowser, Meta Knight, and Ike. These characters were able to get 9 hits with their pummel, Donkey Kong, Pikachu, Jigglypuff, and Sonic along with Ganondorf. I am pretty sure you wouldn't say any of the characters in this 9 group have "very slow" pummels. Ganondorf's pummel is on the slower side of pummel speeds, but it is certainly not "very slow".

On a final note, can you please stop basing all of your edits on only your opinion and experience? If you find something you do not think is correct, do some actual testing instead of just removing or changing the information just because you don't agree with it. [[User:Omega Tyrant|Omega Tyrant]] [[Image: TyranitarMS.png | 25px]] 03:38, May 16, 2010 (UTC)

== matchups? ==

what happened to the matchups?why are almost all of them "?" now?[[User:Gig|Gig]] ([[User talk:Gig|talk]]) 05:35, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
:Because the only documentation of those matchups on SmashBoards is now over a year old, and therefore probably wrong. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Data Node|Data Node]] 07:34, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
(the only one to have 0/100 matchups in Brawl)shouldnt that be taken out of his article then[[User:Gig|Gig]] ([[User talk:Gig|talk]]) 13:54, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
:No, because the matchups that remain are not a year old, and are probably still relevant; and even if no matchups were documented we'd have to show that. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Data Node|Data Node]] 15:38, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
...but theres only 4 now...and none are a 0 matchup,besides id say pikachu vs the space animals are 0 matchups as well,or at least as much of a 0 matchup as any of ganondorfs are,i honestly think ganondorf vs olimar(one of his old 0 matchups)is less of a 0 matchup than pikachu vs a star fox character,and sheik can tilt lock the space animals as much as ganondorf and that was a 0 matchup for ganondorf but not the space animals,i honestly think these matchups should be scraped in general,they all seem to be completely tier biased,and frankly,highly inacurate[[User:Gig|Gig]] ([[User talk:Gig|talk]]) 16:16, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
:May I recomend one thing? Understand matchups before you complain about them. They are not tier biased at all, the matchups you say are completely bull, as only Shiek can even possible have a 100 matchup against Ganondorf while it is not impossible to beat Pikachu with the space animals. Highy inaccurate? Get out and brawl.--<span style="font-family:Forte">[[User:Megatron1|<span style="color:maroon">Mega</span>]][[User talk:Megatron1|<span style="color:silver">Tron1</span>]][[User:Megatron1/Laughology|<span style="color:blue">XD</span>]]</span>[[File:Decepticon.png|20px|:p]] 17:44, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
its not impossible to beat anyone with anybody,very weak defense,pikachu grabs a space animal,you die,if that isnt what defines a 0 matchup then i dont know what is,space animals can beat a pikachu,and ganondorf can beat a sheik,whats your point,its easier to land a grab with pikachu than it is to land sheiks side tilt[[User:Gig|Gig]] ([[User talk:Gig|talk]]) 18:02, 4 November 2010 (EDT)
:If you want to debate matchups, the go to [http://www.smashboards.com/ SmashBoards], since that's where we get the numbers from; arguing about them here is a waste of everyone's time. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Data Node|Data Node]] 18:24, 4 November 2010 (EDT)

==Home-Run Contest==

Who removed his high score from the trivia section? I get removing the part about irony, but it was unecessary to remove his high score from the trivia.
:His HRC high score would be better suited on the HRC page. And remember to sign your comments. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 21:49, 19 January 2011 (EST)

Apparently, that high score was beaten by Ike and Ice Clinmbers.  There's a section above that contains a video.  [[User:Dbrainstorm|Dbrainstorm]] ([[User talk:Dbrainstorm|talk]]) 01:29, 8 July 2011 (EDT)
:That's involves co-op HRC, which is cannot be compared to solo HRC. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 02:23, 8 July 2011 (EDT)

==Grammar==

I tried to fix the part about his combos, even though it's proper English and it makes more sense than before, you still have to look over it more than once to understand. If anyone can make it easier to understand please do. Should "Thunderstorming" be added somewhere so you don't have to keep typing in "short-hop auto-canceled dair"? It would make for less technical jargon which seems to be a problem on this page... [[User:Wawahwario|Wawahwario]] ([[User talk:Wawahwario|talk]]) 14:18, 19 February 2011 (EST)

==Tier list discription==

For that revert of what I just put I think should be still on there because it's incorrect saying "The fact that L-Cancelling doesn't exist in Brawl" and you really shouldn't compare the Melee AT's to the Brawl metagame (Only on the Buff/Nerf sections). Also the RCO Lag Ganon has is also another weakness we should probably mention. [[User:Doc King|Doc King]] ([[User talk:Doc King|talk]]) 11:42, 23 August 2011 (EDT)
:In ''Melee'', Ganondorf was heavily reliant on L-Cancelling, and with its removal, it impacted him greatly in a negative manner. I say that's notable enough to be mention. As for the second thing, I explained in the edit summary, how many readers are going to know what "RCO lag" is? As such, avoid using jargon that is not explained in the article. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 13:22, 23 August 2011 (EDT)
::The L-Cancelling statement I can see, it did improve Ganon as a player in Melee along with Wavedashing. For the rco lag, we can make a page about it and link the rco lag words into the Ganon page so readers can know what it is. [[User:Doc King|Doc King]] ([[User talk:Doc King|talk]]) 16:20, 23 August 2011 (EDT)
:::By "RCO lag", are you referring to the landing lag glitch? <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 16:58, 23 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Yes I am. Like how when we played friendlies after that Deviantart tournament, you were using the side B to make your rco lag have less lag so I couldn't pull off that down throw to f smash combo on you and was soft landing on the platforms so I couldn't punish the rco lag. It's also on Metagame minute episode 10 incase if you didn't know. [[User:Doc King|Doc King]] ([[User talk:Doc King|talk]]) 22:57, 23 August 2011 (EDT)

== Sparta kick ==

I know discussion number 10 talk about this, too, so I googled up sparta kick brawl and found a lot of ganon's sparta kick video, deviantart, picture and atuff. This might be the same case with [[Knee of Justice]], but don't need it's own article... What do you think? [[User:Lucasthefourth|<span style="color:red"> -(C•.•)-'''Lucas'''</span>]][[User talk:Lucasthefourth|'''-IV-''']] [[Special:Contributions/Lucasthefourth|'''A Creeper! Sh-BOOM''']][[Image:Lucas alive.PNG|25px]] 07:03, 18 September 2011 (EDT)
:I think it deserves an article. Any move with particular recognition from the fanbase deserves a paragraph or a page. After all, this is The Smash Bros. Wiki, so if anybody wanted to know about the move, this is where they'd come. If they don't go to SmashWikia. So I support. [[User:ToastUltimatum|<font color="darkorange">Toast</font><font color="darkbrown">Ultimatum</font>]] [[File:Transparent Swadloon.png|27px]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|''<span style="color: silver;">Complaints Box</span>'']] 07:18, 18 September 2011 (EDT)
::Already mentions it is known as the "Sparta Kick". Doesn't need more than that. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 07:19, 18 September 2011 (EDT)
:::o: wow, I search up Sparta Kick in SW and nothing comes out, great.[[User:Lucasthefourth|<span style="color:red"> -(C•.•)-'''Lucas'''</span>]][[User talk:Lucasthefourth|'''-IV-''']] [[Special:Contributions/Lucasthefourth|'''A Creeper! Sh-BOOM''']][[Image:Lucas alive.PNG|25px]] 07:31, 18 September 2011 (EDT)
::::The knee of justice and nipple spike are important due to their significance towards Falcon's playstyle. Sparta Kick is not such a move for Ganon, so it doesn't get an article. [[User:Mr. Anon|Mr. Anon]] ([[User talk:Mr. Anon|talk]]) 12:35, 18 September 2011 (EDT)


== Page Contradiction ==

Okay, so I was reading the page, and in the overview it says that he's the slowest in Brawl, but in Attributes, it says 2nd slowest.
??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????[[User:Louiegie|Louiegie]] ([[User talk:Louiegie|talk]]) 15:36, 10 February 2013 (EST)
:Fixed. <span style="font-family:Impact">''[[User:Brawls of fury|<span style="color:#CC5500">BRAWLS</span>]] [[File:BoFSig.png|19px]] OF [[File:BoFSig.png|19px]][[User talk:Brawls of fury|<span style="color:#8A3324">FURY</span>]]''</span> 15:40, 10 February 2013 (EST)

== Stale-move negation ==

I noticed this keeps getting re-added, so here's a Smashboards [http://smashboards.com/threads/official-swf-tier-list-v8.335959/page-30#post-15507418 post] of mine about this, that goes in a little more detail than the edit summary allows. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 18:17, 29 July 2013 (EDT)

== idle poses ==

ganondorfs idle poses are missing i cant find em--[[User:Pichu+Pichu|Pichu+Pichu]] ([[User talk:Pichu+Pichu|talk]]) 21:09, 25 October 2013 (EDT)

== I have an idea ==

Would it be a good idea to move some info(such as flight of Ganon and any other named combo's and techniques in the attributes section) and put it in it's section? [[User:Smashdude10|Smashdude10]] ([[User talk:Smashdude10|talk]]) 09:49, 26 March 2014 (EDT)

== Up tilt and Warlock Punch ==

I think that those moves's buffs are negligible, since those moves are almost impossible to land in normal circumstances and thus, this make those moves nearly useless. [[User:YoshiKong|YoshiKong]] ([[User talk:YoshiKong|talk]]) 17:06, 20 January 2015 (EST)

== Down Smash "decloning" ==

What was it that made Ganon's down smash decloned from Captain Falcon's? I don't notice any animation change. [[User:Shadow|Shadow]] ([[User talk:Shadow|talk]]) 02:09, 8 May 2015 (EDT)
:Unlike Falcon's, Ganondorf's links (not properly, but it does), is significantly weaker, with much more endlag, and slower transition between kicks. [[User:Ganonmew|Ganonmew]] ([[User talk:Ganonmew|talk]]) 10:47, 18 August 2015 (EDT)

== I'm confused. ==

Ganondorf falls faster? I beg to differ. The falling speed page says no character in Brawl surpasses a falling speed of 2, as Dedede, the fastest caller in Brawl, has 1.95 units of falling speed. It also makes reference to Dedede's falling speed almost surpassing Melee Ganondorf, the tenth fastest called in Melee with a FS of 2, and is the 7th fastest faller in a game where no falling speed surpasses 2. This would mean Ganondorf's falling speed is actually much slower. [[User:Ganonmew|Ganonmew]] ([[User talk:Ganonmew|talk]]) 10:46, 18 August 2015 (EDT)
:Um? It doesn't just say "faster", it says "relative to the rest of the cast". So while the raw number might be smaller, he went from 10th-fastest out of 26 (faster than 61%) to 7th-fastest out of 39 (faster than 82%), which feels faster in a world where everyone is slower. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Quiet 13:14, 18 August 2015 (EDT)
::True, but it says it increases his vertical endurance, worsens his recovery, and makes him easier to combo. This cannot be possible because the raw number is smaller. [[User:Ganonmew|Ganonmew]] ([[User talk:Ganonmew|talk]]) 13:41, 18 August 2015 (EDT)
:::Those facts might also be relative? I mean, it can't be argued that he's worse in those areas despite the raw number being beneficial. Maybe some lesser-known changes are being conflated into "falling speed" or something. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Inconceivable 13:47, 18 August 2015 (EDT)
:::The world may never know... [[User:Ganonmew|Ganonmew]] ([[User talk:Ganonmew|talk]]) 13:53, 18 August 2015 (EDT)
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Formatting	<!----> <br> <code></code> <gallery></gallery> <nowiki></nowiki> <ref></ref> <references/> {{#widget:YouTube\|id=}}
Substitution	<includeonly></includeonly> <noinclude></noinclude>