Editing Jigglypuff (SSBB)
The edit can be undone. Please check the comparison below to verify that this is what you want to do, and then publish the changes below to finish undoing the edit.
Latest revision | Your text | ||
Line 75: | Line 75: | ||
**{{buff|Both hits have larger hitboxes (3.6u → 4.32u). The introduction of [[jab lock]]ing also improves its damage racking ability if the opponent misses a [[tech]]. Lastly, Jigglypuff can quickly repeat the first hit until it connects if the attack button is held.}} | **{{buff|Both hits have larger hitboxes (3.6u → 4.32u). The introduction of [[jab lock]]ing also improves its damage racking ability if the opponent misses a [[tech]]. Lastly, Jigglypuff can quickly repeat the first hit until it connects if the attack button is held.}} | ||
**{{nerf|Its first hit has more ending lag (FAF 16 → 17).}} | **{{nerf|Its first hit has more ending lag (FAF 16 → 17).}} | ||
*[[Forward tilt]]: | *[[Forward tilt]]: | ||
**{{nerf|Forward tilt has more startup lag (frame 6 → 7).}} | **{{nerf|Forward tilt has more startup lag (frame 6 → 7).}} | ||
*[[Up tilt]]: | *[[Up tilt]]: | ||
**{{buff|Up tilt can KO earlier due to the generally slower falling speeds of the cast.}} | **{{buff|Up tilt can KO earlier due to the generally slower falling speeds of the cast.}} | ||
**{{nerf|It has more startup and a shorter duration (frames 8-14 → 9-13). The changes to ''Brawl''{{'}}s physics also makes it significantly less useful for juggling | **{{nerf|It has more startup and a shorter duration (frames 8-14 → 9-13). The changes to ''Brawl''{{'}}s physics also makes it significantly less useful for juggling.}} | ||
*[[Down tilt]]: | *[[Down tilt]]: | ||
**{{nerf|Down tilt has more ending lag (FAF 30 → 31) and smaller hitboxes (3.6u/4u → 3u).}} | **{{nerf|Down tilt has more ending lag (FAF 30 → 31) and smaller hitboxes (3.6u/4u → 3u).}} | ||
Line 88: | Line 86: | ||
**{{nerf|It has more startup (frame 4 → 5).}} | **{{nerf|It has more startup (frame 4 → 5).}} | ||
*[[Forward smash]]: | *[[Forward smash]]: | ||
**{{nerf|Forward smash has more startup (frame 12 → 16) | **{{nerf|Forward smash has more startup (frame 12 → 16) and ending lag (FAF 45 → 55).}} | ||
**{{nerf|It has lower knockback scaling (118 (clean)/105 (late) → 103/80), and its clean hit deals less damage (17% → 16%), | **{{nerf|It has lower knockback scaling (118 (clean)/105 (late) → 103/80), and its clean hit deals less damage (17% → 16%), hindering its KO potential.}} | ||
*[[Up smash]]: | *[[Up smash]]: | ||
**{{buff|[[Up smash]]'s sweetspot now takes priority over its sourspot, making it | **{{buff|[[Up smash]]'s sweetspot now takes priority over its sourspot, making it easier to hit. Both are also larger (4u/6u → 4.8u/7.2u).}} | ||
**{{nerf|Up smash has much more startup (frame 7 → 16) and | **{{nerf|Up smash has much more startup (frame 7 → 16) and ending lag (FAF 45 → 54). It also has lower knockback scaling (110 → 100), and its sourspot deals less damage (14% → 13%), hindering its KO potential.}} | ||
**{{change|Up smash's angle has been altered (90° → 87°).}} | **{{change|Up smash's angle has been altered (90° → 87°).}} | ||
*[[Down smash]]: | *[[Down smash]]: | ||
**{{buff|[[Down smash]]'s hitboxes are larger ( | **{{buff|[[Down smash]]'s hitboxes are larger (4u/4.8u → 4.8u/5.6u).}} | ||
**{{nerf|Down smash has | **{{nerf|Down smash has more startup (frame 9 → 14) and ending lag (FAF 48 → 53).}} | ||
***{{change|It has an altered animation, where Jigglypuff appears to wind up for the attack, before returning to a standing position and winding up a second time and actually attacking, causing the animation to look unfinished.}} | ***{{change|It has an altered animation, where Jigglypuff appears to wind up for the attack, before returning to a standing position and winding up a second time and actually attacking, causing the animation to look unfinished.}} | ||
**{{change|Down smash now sends grounded opponents sliding along flat surfaces even at percents where it would otherwise cause [[tumbling]], including 999%. This prevents them from teching the move to survive, and allows it to take better advantage of [[edge slipping]], but reduces its KO potential against opponents with high traction.}} | **{{change|Down smash now sends grounded opponents sliding along flat surfaces even at percents where it would otherwise cause [[tumbling]], including 999%. This prevents them from teching the move to survive, and allows it to take better advantage of [[edge slipping]], but reduces its KO potential against opponents with high traction.}} | ||
===Aerial attacks=== | ===Aerial attacks=== | ||
Line 107: | Line 103: | ||
*{{buff|All aerials except up aerial have gained the ability to [[lock]] opponents.}} | *{{buff|All aerials except up aerial have gained the ability to [[lock]] opponents.}} | ||
*{{buff|Jigglypuff's slower falling speed enables it to perform multiple aerials in a short hop such as two forward or back aerials.}} | *{{buff|Jigglypuff's slower falling speed enables it to perform multiple aerials in a short hop such as two forward or back aerials.}} | ||
*[[Neutral aerial]]: | *[[Neutral aerial]]: | ||
**{{buff|Neutral aerial has a slightly longer duration (frames 6-28 → 6-29) | **{{buff|Neutral aerial has a slightly longer duration (frames 6-28 → 6-29), less ending lag (FAF 50 → 44), and its clean hit has increased knockback (10 (base)/70 (scaling) → 20/90).}} | ||
**{{nerf|It deals less damage (12% (clean/9% (late) → 10%/6%), and its late hit has lower knockback scaling (80 → 70 | **{{nerf|It deals less damage (12% (clean/9% (late) → 10%/6%), and its late hit has lower knockback scaling (80 → 70). It also auto-cancels later due to the move's longer duration (frame 29 → 30).}} | ||
*[[Forward aerial]]: | *[[Forward aerial]]: | ||
**{{buff|Forward aerial's clean hit has increased knockback (10 (base)/100 (scaling) → 30/108), | **{{buff|Forward aerial's clean hit has increased knockback (10 (base)/100 (scaling) → 30/108), allowing it to KO more effectively at high percents.}} | ||
**{{nerf|Forward aerial has more startup lag with a shorter duration (frames 7-22 → 8-20), and more ending lag (FAF 35 → 37). Its late hit also deals less damage (7% → 6%) and knockback (10 (base)/80 (scaling) → 12/70).}} | **{{nerf|Forward aerial has more startup lag with a shorter duration (frames 7-22 → 8-20), and more ending lag (FAF 35 → 37). Its late hit also deals less damage (7% → 6%) and knockback (10 (base)/80 (scaling) → 12/70).}} | ||
*[[Back aerial]]: | *[[Back aerial]]: | ||
**{{buff|Back aerial has less startup lag (frame 9 → 8).}} | **{{buff|Back aerial has less startup lag (frame 9 → 8).}} | ||
***{{buff|As a result, the hitboxes now become active a frame before Jigglypuff actually kicks its foot, resulting in the move having a large disjoint for its first active frame.}} | ***{{buff|As a result, the hitboxes now become active a frame before Jigglypuff actually kicks its foot, resulting in the move having a large disjoint for its first active frame.}} | ||
**{{buff|It has larger hitboxes ( | **{{buff|It has larger hitboxes (4u/4u/4.4u → 4u/4.5u/5u).}} | ||
**{{nerf|Its hitboxes are no longer attached to Jigglypuff's leg but rather, they are now stationary. While this allows the move to cover a set area more consistently throughout the active duration of the move and it allows the move to cover more of Jigglypuff's body, it significantly decreases its range, as the position of the hitboxes was not fully compensated (z offset: 2.0/-0.4/0 → -12/-8/4). As a result, the move is now only slightly disjointed | **{{nerf|Its hitboxes are no longer attached to Jigglypuff's leg but rather, they are now stationary. While this allows the move to cover a set area more consistently throughout the active duration of the move and it allows the move to cover more of Jigglypuff's body, it significantly decreases its range, as the position of the hitboxes was not fully compensated (z offset: 2.0/-0.4/0 → -12/-8/4). As a result, the move is now only slightly disjointed, making it a much less effective spacing tool.}} | ||
**{{nerf|It has more ending lag (FAF 31 → 33).}} | **{{nerf|It has more ending lag (FAF 31 → 33).}} | ||
**{{nerf|It has decreased knockback scaling (100 → 90).}} | **{{nerf|It has decreased knockback scaling (100 → 90).}} | ||
***{{nerf|Altogether these changes combined with Jigglypuff's worse air mobility and the introduction of hitstun canceling reduce its effectiveness as a [[Wall of Pain]].}} | |||
*[[Up aerial]]: | *[[Up aerial]]: | ||
**{{buff|Up aerial has less startup lag with a longer duration much like its ''Smash 64'' counterpart (frames 9-12 → 8-16), and it has less ending lag (FAF 38 → 37).}} | **{{buff|Up aerial has less startup lag with a longer duration much like its ''Smash 64'' counterpart (frames 9-12 → 8-16), and it has less ending lag (FAF 38 → 37).}} | ||
**{{change|It now has three smaller hitboxes rather than one large hitbox (5.6u → 4u/4u/4u) | **{{change|It now has three smaller hitboxes rather than one large hitbox (5.6u → 4u/4u/4u).}} | ||
**{{change|Its angle has been altered (90° → 88°).}} | **{{change|Its angle has been altered (90° → 88°).}} | ||
**{{nerf|It deals less damage (12% → 9%). This hinders its KO potential, while the changes to ''Brawl''{{'}}s physics also significantly hinder its combo and juggling potential.}} | **{{nerf|It deals less damage (12% → 9%). This hinders its KO potential, while the changes to ''Brawl''{{'}}s physics also significantly hinder its combo and juggling potential.}} | ||
*[[Down aerial]]: | *[[Down aerial]]: | ||
**{{buff|Down aerial is now capable of [[trip]]ping opponents at higher percents. Combined with the move's ability to auto-cancel in a short hop, this improves its setup potential. It also deals more total damage (14.74% → 16%) due to the changes to [[stale-move negation]].}} | **{{buff|Down aerial is now capable of [[trip]]ping opponents at higher percents. Combined with the move's ability to auto-cancel in a short hop, this improves its setup potential. It also deals more total damage (14.74% → 16%) due to the changes to [[stale-move negation]].}} | ||
**{{change|With the introduction of multipliers for [[hitlag]] and [[SDI]] in ''Brawl'', down aerial has received a below-average hitlag multiplier (0.8×), but an above-average [[SDI multiplier]] (1.2×). This makes SDI more effective against the move, but gives opponents less time to execute it.}} | **{{change|With the introduction of multipliers for [[hitlag]] and [[SDI]] in ''Brawl'', down aerial has received a below-average hitlag multiplier (0.8×), but an above-average [[SDI multiplier]] (1.2×). This makes SDI more effective against the move, but gives opponents less time to execute it.}} | ||
===Throws/other attacks=== | ===Throws/other attacks=== | ||
*[[Grab]]s: | *[[Grab]]s: | ||
**{{buff|Standing and dash grabs have less startup (frame 7 → 6 (standing), frame 12 → 11 (dash)) and ending lag (FAF 31 → 30 (standing), FAF 41 → 40 (dash)) | **{{buff|Standing and dash grabs have less startup (frame 7 → 6 (standing), frame 12 → 11 (dash)) and ending lag (FAF 31 → 30 (standing), FAF 41 → 40 (dash)).}} | ||
*[[Pummel]]: | *[[Pummel]]: | ||
**{{buff|[[Pummel]] is faster (30 → 20 frames).}} | **{{buff|[[Pummel]] is faster (30 → 20 frames).}} | ||
*[[Forward throw]]: | *[[Forward throw]]: | ||
**{{nerf|[[Forward throw]] deals less damage (12% → 10%), and its first hit no longer overrides the throw itself, severely decreasing the move's knockback (40 (base)/110 (scaling) → 100/30) and giving it a higher angle (361° → 55°) against grabbed targets as a result. This significantly worsens its edgeguarding and KO potential, going from the second strongest forward throw in ''Melee'' to among the weakest in ''Brawl''.}} | **{{nerf|[[Forward throw]] deals less damage (12% → 10%), and its first hit no longer overrides the throw itself, severely decreasing the move's knockback (40 (base)/110 (scaling) → 100/30) and giving it a higher angle (361° → 55°) against grabbed targets as a result. This significantly worsens its edgeguarding and KO potential, going from the second strongest forward throw in ''Melee'' to among the weakest in ''Brawl''.}} | ||
*[[Up throw]]: | *[[Up throw]]: | ||
**{{nerf|[[Up throw]] deals less damage (11% → 10%) and knockback (130 (base)/25 (scaling) → 110/30). While this would make it better for combos, the universally decreased falling speeds and the introduction of hitstun canceling have completely removed its combo potential, including the [[space animal slayer]].}} | **{{nerf|[[Up throw]] deals less damage (11% → 10%) and knockback (130 (base)/25 (scaling) → 110/30). While this would make it better for combos, the universally decreased falling speeds and the introduction of hitstun canceling have completely removed its combo potential, including the [[space animal slayer]].}} | ||
*[[Down throw]]: | *[[Down throw]]: | ||
**{{buff|[[Down throw]] now consists of only one hit right before the throw, instead of five hits as Jigglypuff rolls on the opponent. However, the move still deals more total damage (1% (hits 1-4)/3% (hit 5)/2% (throw) → 4% (hit 1)/6% (throw) | **{{buff|[[Down throw]] now consists of only one hit right before the throw, instead of five hits as Jigglypuff rolls on the opponent. However, the move still deals more total damage (1% (hits 1-4)/3% (hit 5)/2% (throw) → 4% (hit 1)/6% (throw)).}} | ||
*[[Floor attack]]: | *[[Floor attack]]: | ||
**{{nerf|[[Floor attack]]s deal consistent damage per hit (8%/6% → 6%).}} | **{{nerf|[[Floor attack]]s deal consistent damage per hit (8%/6% → 6%).}} | ||
Line 165: | Line 154: | ||
*[[Sing]]: | *[[Sing]]: | ||
**{{buff|Sing now counts as three separate hitboxes rather than one hitbox which respawns three times. This means that if the opponent shields the first wave, they can now get hit by the other waves.}} | **{{buff|Sing now counts as three separate hitboxes rather than one hitbox which respawns three times. This means that if the opponent shields the first wave, they can now get hit by the other waves.}} | ||
**{{nerf|Sing has more startup | **{{nerf|Sing has more startup and significantly higher ending lag, with its first two waves having shorter durations (frames 28-35, 69-76, 113-125 → 29-33, 73-77, 122-134), and now triggers [[counterattack]]s. It can also no longer reset the sleep duration of an already [[asleep]] opponent, preventing it from being used to indefinitely [[stall]] them out.}} | ||
**{{change|Its soundwaves are now only yellow instead of being colorful. Jigglypuff also now opens its eyes once the song is over instead of opening them at the last part of the song.}} | **{{change|Its soundwaves are now only yellow instead of being colorful. Jigglypuff also now opens its eyes once the song is over instead of opening them at the last part of the song.}} | ||
*[[Rest]]: | *[[Rest]]: | ||
**{{buff|Instead of using the [[flame]] effect, Rest applies a [[flower]] to the opponent, which causes much more damage (28% → 45%) if the opponent applies no [[button mashing]]. It also has one extra frame of [[intangibility]] (frames 1-26 → 1-27).}} | **{{buff|Instead of using the [[flame]] effect, Rest applies a [[flower]] to the opponent, which causes much more damage (28% → 45%) if the opponent applies no [[button mashing]]. It also has one extra frame of [[intangibility]] (frames 1-26 → 1-27).}} | ||
**{{nerf|It has more startup (frame 1 → 2), and deals significantly less initial damage (28% → 15%) along with | **{{nerf|It has more startup (frame 1 → 2), and deals significantly less initial damage (28% → 15%) along with less knockback (78 (base)/120 (scaling) → 100/75), greatly reducing its KO potential and overall utility.}} | ||
**{{change|Rest launches opponents at a vertical angle ([[Sakurai angle|361°]] → 88°), increasing its safety onstage if it KOs the opponent, but hindering its safety offstage and further reducing its KO ability near edges.}} | **{{change|Rest launches opponents at a vertical angle ([[Sakurai angle|361°]] → 88°), increasing its safety onstage if it KOs the opponent, but hindering its safety offstage and further reducing its KO ability near edges.}} | ||
**{{change|In the Japanese language, Jigglypuff gained a new voice clip for performing Rest again; the move's voice clip from ''Melee'' can still be heard when Jigglypuff is [[stun]]ned, though it is difficult to hear due to breaking its shield usually causes a [[self-destruct]].}} | **{{change|In the Japanese language, Jigglypuff gained a new voice clip for performing Rest again; the move's voice clip from ''Melee'' can still be heard when Jigglypuff is [[stun]]ned, though it is difficult to hear due to breaking its shield usually causes a [[self-destruct]].}} | ||
*[[Puff Up]]: | *[[Puff Up]]: |