Source Universe?Edit
Given how they showed off this item, I was given the impression it was either: The Black Hole from Super Mario Galaxy that would suck you in if you fell off the stage, the Black Hole Bomb from Mega Man 9 (Though the Black Hole Bomb is already used in MM's Final Smash, so I'm guessing not that) or some item I don't know about from Bayonetta due to them using her to show off the item. Whichever one, I'm fairly certain it's not Smash-originated, and we can't just label everything as Smash Universe because we don't know. THat's speculative. We shouldn't put anything in there until we have official confirmation of the Black Hole belonging to a certain universe. It might end up being a Drill/Drill Arm situation, but we don't know for sure it's a Smash item, so that should not be mentioned. 72.133.91.93 15:18, 21 September 2018 (EDT)Blueflame105
- Is there any in-game information about the source of each item? (I know Ultimate isn't out yet, but has information that would confirm game origin been available in previous games?) – Emmett 15:34, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- I mean, this exists... Aidan, the Rurouni 15:39, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- It's worth noting that the Black Hole item is called "Black Ball" in Japanese (as a pun off "Black Hole", nonetheless, since they're only one character apart), while the first part of Palutena's Final Smash is just called "Black Hole", like the Power in Uprising. We've also seen footage of Black Hole Laser from Palutena's character video, and it looks significantly different from the item. But since nothing we've seen has indicated it has origins in Kid Icarus, Smash, or any other universe, I agree we could probably hold off on listing it in one particular universe. DryKirby64 (talk) 18:21, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- I mean, this exists... Aidan, the Rurouni 15:39, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Clearly we're fine with citing the Staff as belonging to Kid Icarus even without official confirmation, so in a case like this where there's no clear origin in another universe, I don't see the issue with citing it as belonging to Smash. SuperFalconBros (talk) 18:26, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Well, with the staff, it is very clearly and obviously the Insight Staff from Kid Icarus Uprising, whereas the Black Hole could be from Mario, Mega Man, Kid Icarus or who knows where. (I don’t hunk it’s he Black Hole power from KI, they look very different.) 72.133.91.93 18:53, 21 September 2018 (EDT)Blueflame105
- Agreed here; compared to the Staff's very apparent origin, I think it's better to be safe than sorry with the Black Hole. (Same with the Banana Gun, since it could possibly be listed under the Mario universe given its association with the Banana Peel.) DryKirby64 (talk) 20:36, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Especially since the Black Hole could also be from Kirby - see Kirby: Triple Deluxe. Black Vulpine of the Furry Nation. Furries make the internets go! :3 21:26, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Agreed here; compared to the Staff's very apparent origin, I think it's better to be safe than sorry with the Black Hole. (Same with the Banana Gun, since it could possibly be listed under the Mario universe given its association with the Banana Peel.) DryKirby64 (talk) 20:36, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Well, with the staff, it is very clearly and obviously the Insight Staff from Kid Icarus Uprising, whereas the Black Hole could be from Mario, Mega Man, Kid Icarus or who knows where. (I don’t hunk it’s he Black Hole power from KI, they look very different.) 72.133.91.93 18:53, 21 September 2018 (EDT)Blueflame105
- So, should we list the Universe as “Unknown” for now? It just doesn’t seem right to put everything we’re uncertain of under Smash, as that’s generic and unhelpful info. Really, with that logic, they’re all Smash Universe and they’re just based on other Universe’s things. 72.133.91.93 22:06, 21 September 2018 (EDT)Blueflame105
- The Smash universe strictly encases original creations for the game. If an item is from another series (and is used in the same way it is used there), then it's from that universe.
- That said, listing it as unknown feels out of place to me. The Smash universe is sort of a default. Aidan, the Rurouni 22:08, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
- Yeah, I think that's sorta my problem. I really feel like Smash shouldn't be default. Like you said, that should be a category for things originating in Smash. The Timer works as aSmash Item, because while it looks similar to a real-world object, it functions in an entirely different way. Whereas with the Black Hole, it does what it normally does in life (albeit at an exceedingly lower capacity) so one can't accurately say it was made up for Smash. Probably more my personal problem than anything else, but it should at least be given some thought. 72.133.91.93 08:44, 22 September 2018 (EDT) Blueflame105
- That said, listing it as unknown feels out of place to me. The Smash universe is sort of a default. Aidan, the Rurouni 22:08, 21 September 2018 (EDT)