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Forum:General proposals/Archive 3: Difference between revisions
→Stop putting in frame data/damage values/etc. in Smash Ultimate's Changes sections
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::@Fitzpeter: As seen by the Mega Man down smash example or people who played Smash 4's E3 2014 demo claiming aerials there had a lot more landing lag, it's really not, and a lot of these values being put in have questionable authenticity to them (in the frame data counting, how do the people know there weren't any frame skips in the video or that the player acted as soon as they could, and how would one deduce a hitbox's size or actual knockback changes without being able to actually test the game?). Plus the game isn't even released yet, so there should be no rush to try getting specific frame data and the like down, no one is actually going to be able to utilize it. | ::@Fitzpeter: As seen by the Mega Man down smash example or people who played Smash 4's E3 2014 demo claiming aerials there had a lot more landing lag, it's really not, and a lot of these values being put in have questionable authenticity to them (in the frame data counting, how do the people know there weren't any frame skips in the video or that the player acted as soon as they could, and how would one deduce a hitbox's size or actual knockback changes without being able to actually test the game?). Plus the game isn't even released yet, so there should be no rush to try getting specific frame data and the like down, no one is actually going to be able to utilize it. | ||
::@Alex: By that point the game is actually released, we were actually playing the game, actually able to datamine and thoroughly test stuff to determine accurate values, and there's quite a difference between playing a demo that's 6+ months out from release where so much is liable to change and is clearly not meant to be the final product, and a balance patch that adjusts some values to some characters and are never guaranteed to actually happen. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 07:00, 29 June 2018 (EDT) | ::@Alex: By that point the game is actually released, we were actually playing the game, actually able to datamine and thoroughly test stuff to determine accurate values, and there's quite a difference between playing a demo that's 6+ months out from release where so much is liable to change and is clearly not meant to be the final product, and a balance patch that adjusts some values to some characters and are never guaranteed to actually happen. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 07:00, 29 June 2018 (EDT) | ||
::I don't think this is a problem, though. Detailed data is just better data. Any data can be changed, and we'll have to document it when it changes, and there's no practical difference between data with real values and data with vague wording except that numbers are a lot more satisfying. With recordings we can know damage and frame data precisely, and there's no point in not including it deliberately, and it would be silly to take it out. [[User:Fitzpeter|Fitzpeter]] ([[User talk:Fitzpeter|talk]]) 12:33, 30 June 2018 (EDT) | |||
:'''Support''' I don't even see how this is debatable: ''the game is not out yet''. We report on the technical stuff ''when the game comes out''. That is how it has been, and how it needs to be. An unreleased game is an unfinished game. ([[wikipedia:Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)|Even though a released game can]] [[wikipedia:Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric|sometimes be unfinished too...]]) [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]], [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the College-Bound Rurouni'''</span>]] 15:48, 29 June 2018 (EDT) | :'''Support''' I don't even see how this is debatable: ''the game is not out yet''. We report on the technical stuff ''when the game comes out''. That is how it has been, and how it needs to be. An unreleased game is an unfinished game. ([[wikipedia:Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)|Even though a released game can]] [[wikipedia:Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric|sometimes be unfinished too...]]) [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]], [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the College-Bound Rurouni'''</span>]] 15:48, 29 June 2018 (EDT) | ||
:'''Support'''. I agree 100%. I thought it was very odd to see such technical details on an unreleased game for which most of the video we have are off-screen phone recordings. [[User:Anthony1996|Anthony1996]] ([[User talk:Anthony1996|talk]]) 02:02, 30 June 2018 (EDT) | :'''Support'''. I agree 100%. I thought it was very odd to see such technical details on an unreleased game for which most of the video we have are off-screen phone recordings. [[User:Anthony1996|Anthony1996]] ([[User talk:Anthony1996|talk]]) 02:02, 30 June 2018 (EDT) | ||