Talk:Tier list: Difference between revisions

Talk:Tier list (edit)

Revision as of 22:09, July 5, 2021

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→‎Should we create a section about online tier lists and the differences between online and offline tier lists

Cookies and Creme

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 :The difference between online and offline is too subjective to be reliable. Ultimate also doesn't have a tier list, making the proposed section pointless. [[User:Zeckemyro|Hitbox Enthusiast Zeck]] ([[User talk:Zeckemyro|talk]]) 17:42, July 5, 2021 (EDT)
 ::Ganondorf isn't magically top tier online, lol. Lag doesn't change a character's viability. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]], [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Rurouni'''</span>]] 18:06, July 5, 2021 (EDT)
+There is a lot wrong with what you have up there, so I'll break it down:
+:"Ganondorf and all the glass cannons out there literally own online due to them being way harder to punish"
+::Except, they don't own online. Aside from Game & Watch, who himself is already widely considered a top tier offline, most glass cannons still see little to no results. You point out Ganondorf as an example, but not only does Ganondorf have [[WWR v6|no representation at all on the current Wi-Fi Warrior Rank]], but even in the online SWT qualifiers, which features some of the most stacked online tournaments ever, Ganondorf [https://www.pgstats.com/articles/win-rates-and-pick-rates-at-the-online-qualifiers-super-smash-bros-ultimate is rather uncommon and has more losses than wins]. Even if you ignore SWT, Ganondorf still sees little representation at the major online tournaments. For example, the S-tier tournament {{Trn|The Airlock}} only has 2 Ganondorf players in top 48 and none past top 24. If Ganondorf truly does "owns" online, then we'd be Ganondorf players place consistently in top 16 at major tournaments like The Airlock.
+:"the fast agile top tiers are heavily hindered by the gameplay alterations"
+::Pikachu and Roy are fast, agile top tier characters, yet they still continue to do very well online. In addition, even though Peach and Joker are seen as worse than their offline counterparts, they aren't suddenly low tier due to the input delay. What about Samsora, who despite having a bad time online still managed to rank in the top 50 on the [[WWR v5|most stacked online season yet]]? Or Sharp, who has pulled out Joker as a secondary and co-main at several WWR-ranked tournaments and seen success?
+:"Due to increased input delay and gameplay differences online, the 2 types of tier lists are completely different"
+::Kind of a reiteration on my point, but the input delay, while affects characters, does not really affect their viability. Strong online characters such as Ness, Game & Watch, R.O.B., and Min Min are still strong characters offline. On the other hand, while weak offline characters such as Little Mac, Jigglypuff, and even Ganondorf have their good Wi-Fi Warriors, they still have overall abysmal performances online. Despite the common perception, for the most part the characters who are good offline are still good online, and the characters who are bad online may have a bit more benefits online, but are ultimately still bad online.
+Finally, with DLC ongoing until December, we won't see an actual, "good" ''Ultimate'' tier list until at least a year later, so even if we do consider an online tier list, we won't be adding one anytime soon. [[User:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia;color: black;">Cookies</span>]][[File:CnC Signature.png|20px]][[User talk:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia; color: black;">Creme</span>]] 23:09, July 5, 2021 (EDT)