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Greninja (SSBU): Difference between revisions
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|ssbgame1 = SSB4 | |ssbgame1 = SSB4 | ||
|availability = [[Unlockable character|Unlockable]] | |availability = [[Unlockable character|Unlockable]] | ||
|tier = | |tier = B+ | ||
|ranking = | |ranking = 34 | ||
}} | }} | ||
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Billy Bob Thompson, Yūji Ueda, Frédéric Clou and Benedikt Gutjan's portrayals of Greninja from ''[[Super Smash Bros. 4]]'' were repurposed for the English, Japanese, French and German versions of ''Ultimate'', respectively. | Billy Bob Thompson, Yūji Ueda, Frédéric Clou and Benedikt Gutjan's portrayals of Greninja from ''[[Super Smash Bros. 4]]'' were repurposed for the English, Japanese, French and German versions of ''Ultimate'', respectively. | ||
Greninja is ranked | Greninja is ranked 34th out of 82 on the current [[tier list]], placing it in the B+ tier. This is a marginal rise from its 26th out of 54 placement in ''SSB4''. | ||
==How to unlock== | ==How to unlock== | ||
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In terms of universal changes, some of them are as benefitial as they are detrimental to Greninja. The changes to [[air dodge]] mechanics slightly improve its previously below average edgeguarding game, but also make it more vulnerable to combos. The increased [[shieldstun]] makes Greninja's own attacks much safer on shield, but also weakens its already poor [[out of shield]] game, forcing it to abuse the revamped perfect shielding. Lastly, the weakening of [[rage]] makes it slightly harder for Greninja to take advantage of it, despite compensating for its lighter weight. | In terms of universal changes, some of them are as benefitial as they are detrimental to Greninja. The changes to [[air dodge]] mechanics slightly improve its previously below average edgeguarding game, but also make it more vulnerable to combos. The increased [[shieldstun]] makes Greninja's own attacks much safer on shield, but also weakens its already poor [[out of shield]] game, forcing it to abuse the revamped perfect shielding. Lastly, the weakening of [[rage]] makes it slightly harder for Greninja to take advantage of it, despite compensating for its lighter weight. | ||
Collectively, Greninja's strengths and weaknesses are more defined. It now performs much better as a hit-and-run, combo-centric character, with excellent mobility and various KO options and set-ups at a variety of percentages, but with its light weight and attributes making it just as vulnerable to combos while keeping its terrible out of shield game. Despite its nerfs to its previous footstool combos, Greninja has been generally compensated due to the gameplay changes to the engine and the buffs to its moveset giving it a more traditional combo game. That said, various veterans have also been buffed to varying degrees, especially through game updates, while Greninja has comparatively received minor, unimpactful changes from them. Nevertheless, Greninja has improved from ''SSB4'', keeping up with the rest of the cast | Collectively, Greninja's strengths and weaknesses are more defined. It now performs much better as a hit-and-run, combo-centric character, with excellent mobility and various KO options and set-ups at a variety of percentages, but with its light weight and attributes making it just as vulnerable to combos while keeping its terrible out of shield game. Despite its nerfs to its previous footstool combos, Greninja has been generally compensated due to the gameplay changes to the engine and the buffs to its moveset giving it a more traditional combo game. That said, various veterans have also been buffed to varying degrees, especially through game updates, while Greninja has comparatively received minor, unimpactful changes from them. Nevertheless, Greninja has improved from ''SSB4'', keeping up with the rest of the cast in ''Ultimate''. | ||
{{SSB4 to SSBU changelist|char=Greninja}} | {{SSB4 to SSBU changelist|char=Greninja}} | ||
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==In [[competitive play]]== | ==In [[competitive play]]== | ||
===Most historically significant players=== | ===Most historically significant players=== | ||
<!--This character has a ten player limit for this section. Before adding and/or removing a player, read these guidelines: https://www.ssbwiki.com/SmashWiki:Notability#%22Most_historically_significant_players%22_guidelines --> | <!--This character has a ten player limit for this section. Before adding and/or removing a player, read these guidelines: https://www.ssbwiki.com/SmashWiki:Notability#%22Most_historically_significant_players%22_guidelines --> | ||
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''See also: [[:Category:Greninja players (SSBU)]]'' | ''See also: [[:Category:Greninja players (SSBU)]]'' | ||
*{{Sm| | *{{Sm|iStudying|Netherlands}} - One of the best Greninja players in Europe in the early metagame, with his best results being placing 7th at {{Trn|Tech Republic IV}} defeating {{Sm|quiK}}, placing 9th at {{Trn|Ultimate Fighting Arena 2019}}, and defeating {{Sm|Stroder}} at {{Trn|EVO 2019}}. He remained the second-best European Greninja player in the post-online metagame, most notably placing 9th at {{Trn|Temple: Hermès Edition}} defeating {{Sm|Tilde}}, but became inactive by the end of 2022. | ||
*{{Sm|JW|Canada}} - The second-best Greninja player in North America in the early metagame and the best player from Canada for the first half of 2019. He is best known for defeating {{Sm|MkLeo}} at {{Trn|Pound 2019}}, ultimately placing 9th, and he has also placed 13th at {{Trn|Shine 2019}} defeating {{Sm|Goblin}} and 17th at {{Trn|The Big House 9}} defeating {{Sm|Kola}} and {{Sm|ESAM}}. Although less active in the post-online metagame, he remained Canada's best Greninja player, notably placing 4th at {{Trn|Pinnacle 2021}} defeating {{Sm|Ouch!?}}, before becoming inactive in 2023. | |||
*{{Sm| | *{{Sm|Lea|Japan}} - The best Greninja player of all-time who spearheaded Greninja's early metagame, ranking 21st on the [[Fall 2019 PGRU]] and placing 5th at several {{Trn|Umebura|series}} majors as well as 7th at {{Trn|2GG: Kongo Saga}} defeating {{Sm|Shuton}} and {{Sm|Dabuz}}. He remained the best Greninja player in the world until his hiatus in mid-2022, notably placing 7th at {{Trn|Kagaribi 7}} during this time, and has sporadically competed since with mixed results. | ||
*{{Sm|Lea|Japan}} - | *{{Sm|Somé|Japan}} - The second-best Greninja player in Japan's early metagame, winning {{Trn|Karisuma SP 4}} and {{Trn|TSC 11}}, and also placing 7th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 4}} defeating {{Sm|Etsuji}}, 9th at {{Trn|Umebura SP 6}} defeating {{Sm|HIKARU}}, and 13th at {{Trn|Umebura SP 4}}. He took a hiatus from offline competitive play due to the pandemic and did not return until 2023. | ||
*{{Sm| | *{{Sm|Stroder Ame|USA}} - Plays a variety of characters and primarily played Greninja in the early metagame. He was the second-best Greninja player in the world during this time, ranking 29th on the [[Spring 2019 PGRU]]. He is best known for winning {{Trn|Crown}} over {{Sm|Kurama}} and has also placed 5th at {{Trn|Ultimate Nimbus}} defeating {{Sm|Tweek}}, 5th at {{Trn|Glitch 8 - Missingno}} defeating {{Sm|Cosmos}} and {{Sm|Maister}}, and 13th at {{Trn|2GG: Prime Saga}} defeating {{Sm|ESAM}}. He has since switched to other characters but continues to use Greninja as an occasional secondary. | ||
*{{Sm|Tarik|Germany}} - The second-best Greninja player of all-time and the best Greninja player after Lea's hiatus, ranking 55th on the [[LumiRank 2023]]. He is one of the best players in Europe in the post-online metagame, having placed 7th at several European majors such as {{Trn|Ultimate Fighting Arena 2023}} and {{Trn|King Con}} and having multiple wins over {{Sm|Bloom4Eva}} at ranked events. Internationally, he is known for placing 5th at {{Trn|Rise 'N Grind 2023}} defeating {{Sm|SHADIC}} and defeating {{Sm|Shuton}} at {{Trn|Port Priority 8}}, {{Sm|Onin}} at {{Trn|GENESIS X}}, and {{Sm|ShinyMark}} at {{Trn|Battle of BC 5}}. | |||
*{{Sm| | *{{Sm|Tsuna|Japan}} - A known Greninja player in Japan since the early metagame, having placing 2nd at {{Trn|Karisuma SP 6}}, 5th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 10}}, and 9th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 11}} during this time. He has since become the best Greninja player in Japan following Lea's hiatus, frequently placing at or near the top 8 at {{Trn|Sumabato}} events, including 5th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 46}} over {{Sm|Asimo}} and {{Sm|Jogibu}}. | ||
*{{Sm| | |||
===Tier placement and history=== | |||
In the early metagame, players quickly noticed that Greninja had been buffed from ''Smash 4'', with improved versatility and speed, and despite losing its [[footstool]] combos, it gained a stronger combo game thanks to improved frame data on moves such as its dash attack, up throw, down throw, and neutral air. Greninja's high learning curve did not deter players such as {{Sm|Stroder}}, {{Sm|Jw}}, and {{Sm|Lea}} from seeing success with the character, and Greninja became a popular pick in competitive play, culminating in the character peaking at 10th in terms of representation between July and December 2019. Due to Greninja's buffs and its strong representation, it was considered an upper-high tier character in the early metagame. | |||
This perception shifted following the end of the online metagame, especially as Greninja players began pointing out frustrating traits in the character's movesets, most notably inconsistencies in Greninja's multihit moves. Furthermore, Greninja's best players from before the pandemic either became less active, changed mains, or had worse performance: for example, Lea would go on hiatus in 2022, with mixed results in the events he has attended since, while Stroder would begin playing other characters over Greninja. Although Greninja still saw strong results from players such as {{Sm|Tarik}}, Greninja's overall representation would drop, bottoming out at 45th between January and June 2022. Greninja's lower representation and more apparent flaws led to a colder reception than in the early metagame, and as such, Greninja was ranked 33rd on the first tier list, towards the lower end of high tier. | |||
Following the release of the first list, Greninja's results would noticeably improve, thanks to Tarik's results remaining strong and the rise of many other Greninja players, including {{Sm|Tsuna}} and {{Sm|Anarchy}}, in their respective scenes. Continued efforts from dedicated mains prevented Greninja from dropping further, and he only slid down a spot to 34th on the second list, ranking towards the middle of B+ tier, with this drop mainly being the result of the meteoric rise of {{SSBU|Bayonetta}} and {{SSBU|Corrin}} from the first tier list. Overall, although less common than the early metagame, Greninja remains a rather viable pick in the post-online metagame. | |||
=={{SSBU|Classic Mode}}: Your Turn, Greninja!== | =={{SSBU|Classic Mode}}: Your Turn, Greninja!== | ||
[[File:SSBU Congratulations Greninja.png|thumb|Greninja's congratulations screen.]] | [[File:SSBU Congratulations Greninja.png|thumb|Greninja's congratulations screen.]] | ||
Greninja | Greninja battles characters that represent different {{iw|bulbapedia|type}}s from the ''Pokémon'' games: for example, Charizard and Bowser represent the Fire type, while Mewtwo, Ness and Lucas represent the Psychic type. Interestingly, the types represented correspond to those initially available in the {{iw|bulbapedia|Pokémon Trading Card Game}}. | ||
{|class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" | {|class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" | ||
!Round!!Opponent!!Stage!!Music!!Notes | !Round!!Opponent!!Stage!!Music!!Notes | ||
|- | |- | ||
|1||{{CharHead|Charizard|SSBU|hsize=20px}} and {{CharHead|Bowser|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||[[Pokémon Stadium]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Elite Four) / Battle! (Solgaleo/Lunala)}}''||Represents Fire-type. Charizard's {{SSBU|Pokémon Trainer}} is absent. | |1||{{CharHead|Charizard|SSBU|hsize=20px}} and {{CharHead|Bowser|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||[[Pokémon Stadium]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Elite Four) / Battle! (Solgaleo/Lunala)}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Fire}}-type. Charizard's {{SSBU|Pokémon Trainer}} is absent. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|2||{{CharHead|Pikachu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Pichu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Zero Suit Samus|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||[[Pokémon Stadium 2]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Steven)}}''||Represents Electric-type. | |2||{{CharHead|Pikachu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Pichu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Zero Suit Samus|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||[[Pokémon Stadium 2]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Steven)}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Electric}}-type. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|3||{{CharHead|Lucario|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Ryu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Ken|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Reshiram / Zekrom)}}''||Represents Fighting-type. | |3||{{CharHead|Lucario|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Ryu|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Ken|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Reshiram / Zekrom)}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Fighting}}-type. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|4||{{CharHead|Ivysaur|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Gladion)}}''||Represents Grass-type. Ivysaur's Pokémon Trainer is absent. | |4||{{CharHead|Ivysaur|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Gladion)}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Grass}}-type. Ivysaur's Pokémon Trainer is absent. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|5||{{CharHead|Mewtwo|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Ness|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Lucas|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium 2||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Dialga/Palkia) / Spear Pillar}}''||Represents Psychic-type. | |5||{{CharHead|Mewtwo|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, {{CharHead|Ness|SSBU|hsize=20px}}, and {{CharHead|Lucas|SSBU|hsize=20px}}||Pokémon Stadium 2||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Dialga/Palkia) / Spear Pillar}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Psychic}}-type. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|6||{{CharHead|Squirtle|SSBU|hsize=20px}} and {{CharHead|Greninja|SSBU|hsize=20px|color=Black}}||[[Kalos Pokémon League]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Champion) - Pokémon X / Pokémon Y}}''||Represents Water-type. Squirtle's Pokémon Trainer is absent. The CPU will be the {{Head|Greninja|g=SSBU|s=20px}} default Greninja if the player chooses the black costume. | |6||{{CharHead|Squirtle|SSBU|hsize=20px}} and {{CharHead|Greninja|SSBU|hsize=20px|color=Black}}||[[Kalos Pokémon League]]||''{{SSBUMusicLink|Pokémon|Battle! (Champion) - Pokémon X / Pokémon Y}}''||Represents {{iw|bulbapedia|Water}}-type. Squirtle's Pokémon Trainer is absent. The CPU will be the {{Head|Greninja|g=SSBU|s=20px}} default Greninja if the player chooses the black costume. | ||
|- | |- | ||
|colspan="5"|[[Bonus Stage]] | |colspan="5"|[[Bonus Stage]] | ||